(Topic ID: 106728)

ALIEN PINBALL - Game Over, Man, Game Over


By HeighwayPinball

4 years ago



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11
#1251 3 years ago
Quoted from Zampinator:

Right. Not pre-ordering, but a fully refundable reservation. That's a great way to put it. Very little risk involved.

Every time I see someone post this I think of Shit-B and JPop, both of those were supposed to be 100% refundable also. I know, I know, apples and oranges comparing those two to Heighway. But, it's enough to keep me from putting down my refundable reservation.

#1252 3 years ago
Quoted from BillySastard:

Every time I see someone post this I think of Shit-B and JPop, both of those were supposed to be 100% refundable also. I know, I know, apples and oranges comparing those two to Heighway. But, it's enough to keep me from putting down my refundable reservation.

No offense, but $1,500 is not going to hurt me financially. So I say again very Little risk. But I see your point.

#1253 3 years ago
Quoted from Zampinator:

No offense, but $1,500 is not going to hurt me financially. So I say again very Little risk.

Meh. Losing $4750 on Predator didn't hurt me financially. Still sucks though.

#1254 3 years ago

Bunch of richies in here. Jeez.

#1255 3 years ago
Quoted from Chitownpinball:

Bunch of richies in here. Jeez.

lol... teddy buxton don't blink at that little chump change yo

#1256 3 years ago

I always hate losing money, even in smaller amounts. It's really hard to make a purchase decision or cash reservation at this point, at least to me it is. We really only know the theme here. It's a cool theme for sure, but without a visual of the playfield layout (since its changed we cannot use the old one as reference), art, and pricing for standard add-ons, its really hard to commit for me. I know it's supposedly refundable and so far Heighway is doing everything right, but how many people have a FT sitting in their game rooms? It wouldn't take too much in the way of wrong moves for the general sentiment to make a hard turn on Heighway, we've seen it before with other companies.

On another note, I'm not one to drop 8k on a game (not that I can't afford it, just a personal limit), so the LE is likely going to be a pass for me either way. I can't imagine how special it would have to be to get me to change that position, though I suppose its not impossible.

One other thing worth mentioning here. I have found almost without exception, that anytime I make a decision based on emotions, it's pretty much always a bad one. I make better decisions when I settle down and gather all the facts first.

#1257 3 years ago

As stated here before, the art/features/playfield design are still going through changes & the approval process, so I understand why only limited info has been released thus far.

But since the original design is out of date, I'd love to see an updated basic playfield schematic at this point. I can use my imagination to fill in the blanks All in due time I guess

#1258 3 years ago

fortunately, no one is making anyone do anything money-wise....it's an individual, personal choice. While the emotions/ connection to the title are paramount, the research that they have already produced and shipped machines (still intrigued by that Bacardi thing) eases my concerns mightily.

If a company like Bacardi ( they like to make money as well) believed in Andrew, and FOX has granted them the license for a "dream theme"......enough for me.....I don't think anyone should sweat it one way or the other (preorder or not).....just glad it's getting made....

#1259 3 years ago

Well, like I said earlier, just speaking for myself, I'm happy to earn people's purchases, not just ride the theme. I have no doubt that Andrew will be showing more when he's able to, he's not the kind of guy that likes to hold back updates, if you hadn't noticed.

I haven't a clue how many of the LEs have "sold" already, I haven't asked. I won't say I don't care, because sure I do, and I really appreciate the notes people have sent me as they've gone in, you guys are great. But I'm just not focused on it. If we do our job right selling out the LE games isn't going to be an issue.

Will it happen overnight, and if you don't get in now you risk missing one? Beats me man. But at least I know that if you miss out on the LE you're still going to have the same gameplay. We're not taking out the spinner and the drop targets for the Standard, or gimping the RGB LEDs, or removing one of the toys. And if you want the extra beacon lights or fiber optics you can add them.

Find your comfort level, follow along, and do what feels right.

#1260 3 years ago

...is brittle and insanely expensive to work with.

Quoted from Aurich:

Find your comfort level, follow along, and do what feels right.

Or as Joseph Campbell said, "Follow your bliss." =) I definitely want one but Rob Zombie is first.

#1261 3 years ago
Quoted from emkay:

I definitely want one but Rob Zombie is first.

My biggest problem is how to fit Alien and Rob Zombie if I end up with both.

#1262 3 years ago
Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

I hear what you're saying. The hype hasn't taken hold on me, just peaking my interest on a dream theme pin. Valid points for sure, but it's not really a "pre-order" since I'm not required to pay in full. More like an "LE reservation" for a small deposit, which is fully refundable if you change your mind. That's the key point. There really isn't much risk, and I think it's a nice option. As far as the upgrades, I'd probably guess that after you pay for the LE feature upgrades to a standard (along with a 2nd LED for the backbox), you'll probably be pretty close to the same price as the LE, so why not just make a deposit?
But seeing the current playfield schematic would really tempt me to bite on a LE tho

Exactly, and thank you for not taking my post personally (as it certainly wasn't intended that way at all...you are far from the only one who has the same opinion) and responding with good points. I know exactly how you feel.

#1263 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

My biggest problem is how to fit Alien and Rob Zombie if I end up with both.

That's easy. Sell me your Flash Gordon

#1264 3 years ago
Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

That's easy. Sell me your Flash Gordon

Badass pin right there.

#1265 3 years ago
Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

That's easy. Sell me your Flash Gordon

Helllllll no!

Flash Gordon is going nowhere, one of my favorite pins. So great. Really under appreciated IMHO. I can't think of a single ball pin I like more. I really love the early 80s Ballys, have Flash Gordon and Mystic, and a Fathom on loan. I have space for 10 pins but I only list 9 since I don't own the Fathom. If I can find a Medusa I'll sell my Abra Ca Dabra to fit it next to Mystic in my office.

#1266 3 years ago
Quoted from Star_Gazer:

One more!...could not resist...now i'm gonna leave you guys alone, just make it awesome!
alien_sentry_01.jpg

I don't know who you are Dutchman but DP should put you on the payroll. You clearly have a knack for this stuff.

#1267 3 years ago
Quoted from kvan99:

DP should put you on the payroll

Yeah, totally agreed!

#1268 3 years ago

#LV223 here. I cant wait to play this thing.

Is there an option to have the fog machine spit acid instead of fog?

--Jeff

#1269 3 years ago
Quoted from way2wyrd:

#LV223 here. I cant wait to play this thing.
Is there an option to have the fog machine spit acid instead of fog?
--Jeff

I laughed out loud on that one! Can we confirm that the fog machine can be swapped out with an acid machine?
Welcome to the club!

#1270 3 years ago
Quoted from way2wyrd:

#LV223 here. I cant wait to play this thing.
Is there an option to have the fog machine spit acid instead of fog?
--Jeff

Too funny!!!.....glad to see another member in the " 200" club.....

#1271 3 years ago

I spotted the white wood briefly and noticed one of the top flippers being kinda in the center of the playfield. Is there any chance of putting a post/protection at the end of that upper flipper to protected it from shots? I think that after a few random hits w/out protection that upper flipper is going to be needing adjusting due to the constant middle playfield bash shots.

#1272 3 years ago
Quoted from PaulCoff:

I spotted the white wood briefly and noticed one of the top flippers being kinda in the center of the playfield. Is there any chance of putting a post/protection at the end of that upper flipper to protected it from shots? I think that after a few random hits w/out protection that upper flipper is going to be needing adjusting due to the constant middle playfield bash shots.

I wouldn't worry about that flipper.

#1273 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I wouldn't worry about that flipper.

All I need to know. Thanks

#1274 3 years ago
Quoted from Zampinator:

I laughed out loud on that one! Can we confirm that the fog machine can be swapped out with an acid machine?
Welcome to the club!

When I read your post, I imagined a hose mod spraying out Mountain Dew!!

#1275 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I wouldn't worry about that flipper.

On the Alien pre-order page "The widebody game, currently in development, features 4 Flippers"

Are we in for some major changes concerning the reworking of the whitewood? I remember reading there are going to be more shots now. That's a good thing, right?

#1276 3 years ago

It's time to at least see an updated layout. I know game 1 needs attention, but I need to keep interested...

#1277 3 years ago

I'm sure a new layout will be shown as soon as possible, but that's Andrew's department.

I'm always hesitant to speak on things, it's really not my department. But the old whitewood and CAD drawing are definitely out of date, and the changes since then are IMHO real improvements. Same spirit, but refined. And the issues people (rightly) brought up with the upper right flipper have been addressed. Still 4 flippers to be clear, and they all have real shots that matter.

That's all I feel like I can say until we show an update!

#1278 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

That's all I feel like I can say until we show an update!

Completely understand. Glad 4 flippers remain. I hope we get to see a simple rough shot map of the new layout sooner than later. It doesn't have to be too sophisticated or give anything away...the homer.jpg

#1279 3 years ago

Also, as long as I'm revealing "secret" things here that might make Andrew raise his eyebrows at me ( ) I should note that he hasn't been around much recently because the guy just got married! It's all over his Facebook, so hopefully it's not a secret he's gonna be mad at be for blowing up.

He's getting back to work now, but I'm sure he was trying to not think too much about pinball for at least a couple days!

#1280 3 years ago

I liked the floating flipper and the shots that set it up and the shots it fed into. The original layout was very well done (or so it appeared). I hope some of those ideas remain!

I'm excited to see progress but I've really changed my tune on showing work product. I was in way early on WOZ and thought I'd enjoy the process. Looking back, it was a freaking beating with all the MMQB and second guessing going on here. Extended delays aside, the dead space between updates just lead to more critique as people look for something to talk about. I've reluctantly realized that I think Stern has this right. Reveal nothing at all until the package is complete. Show it and capitalize on the wave of frenzy before naysaying sets in.

I know this won't be a popular opinion and I don't like it much either. But I think there is something to it.

#1281 3 years ago
Quoted from PinCrush:

I liked the floating flipper and the shots that set it up and the shots it fed into. The original layout was very well done (or so it appeared). I hope some of those ideas remain!
I'm excited to see progress but I've really changed my tune on showing work product. I was in way early on WOZ and thought I'd enjoy the process. Looking back, it was a freaking beating with all the MMQB and second guessing going on here. Extended delays aside, the dead space between updates just lead to more critique as people look for something to talk about. I've reluctantly realized that I think Stern has this right. Reveal nothing at all until the package is complete. Show it and capitalize on the wave of frenzy before naysaying sets in.
I know this won't be a popular opinion and I don't like it much either. But I think there is something to it.

Are you kidding? It should be a totally popular opinion!

I hate this model. If it were up to me Alien wouldn't even have been announced yet. Blow people away with a surprise and watch the mouths drop, that's how to do it. Building pins is slow, and even when you think you've got dates covered there's a million things that can happen to slow it down that you couldn't possibly have controlled. Even the most drama-free projects don't tick along like clockwork.

I don't like to announce my personal projects ahead of time either really. I've tried it, and it can work, but better to feel like you can throw away all your work and start over without worrying about what people think. The end result is more important than sharing progress.

I don't think Andrew likes it either. But I can understand why he did it. Frankly the climate when Alien was announced in pinball was pretty different. It felt like if you didn't throw your card into the ring people were going to commit all their pinball funds to other pre-orders. It was announce or risk being left out of the game. For a new company trying to build support that's death. And no disrespect to Full Throttle, but as Spooky has learned original themes are a lot harder to sell fast. You need to build them up, you can't count on support from the name alone.

Is what it is, and the game is progressing either way, we're just in this awkward period where there isn't much to talk about publicly. That will change, just going to require some patience.

I'll admit that I do kind of enjoy teasing you guys a little bit. But honestly if I was free to just share anything and everything I would. Once you've let the cat out of the bag I don't like the games and secrets. But it's not my call, and in some ways it's not even Andrew's. We've all seen the drama that can come with showing licensed stuff before approval has happened (see Philgate). Much more important to do things right and have a good end product.

Trust me, the soul of the game is still there, it's just been improved. Every flipper has cool shots. Every flipper has interesting setups. And frankly more shots and more setups than before, with more flow. I'm much happier with it now, as someone who's going to own an LE.

#1282 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Are you kidding? It should be a totally popular opinion!
I hate this model. If it were up to me Alien wouldn't even have been announced yet. Blow people away with a surprise and watch the mouths drop, that's how to do it. Building pins is slow, and even when you think you've got dates covered there's a million things that can happen to slow it down that you couldn't possibly have controlled. Even the most drama-free projects don't tick along like clockwork.
I don't like to announce my personal projects ahead of time either really. I've tried it, and it can work, but better to feel like you can throw away all your work and start over without worrying about what people think. The end result is more important than sharing progress.
I don't think Andrew likes it either. But I can understand why he did it. Frankly the climate when Alien was announced in pinball was pretty different. It felt like if you didn't throw your card into the ring people were going to commit all their pinball funds to other pre-orders. It was announce or risk being left out of the game. For a new company trying to build support that's death. And no disrespect to Full Throttle, but as Spooky has learned original themes are a lot harder to sell fast. You need to build them up, you can't count on support from the name alone.
Is what it is, and the game is progressing either way, we're just in this awkward period where there isn't much to talk about publicly. That will change, just going to require some patience.
I'll admit that I do kind of enjoy teasing you guys a little bit. But honestly if I was free to just share anything and everything I would. Once you've let the cat out of the bag I don't like the games and secrets. But it's not my call, and in some ways it's not even Andrew's. We've all seen the drama that can come with showing licensed stuff before approval has happened (see Philgate). Much more important to do things right and have a good end product.
Trust me, the soul of the game is still there, it's just been improved. Every flipper has cool shots. Every flipper has interesting setups. And frankly more shots and more setups than before, with more flow. I'm much happier with it now, as someone who's going to own an LE.

All good...it will come, and no need for a frenzy....congrats to Andrew on the marriage!!!....mark

#1283 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Helllllll no!
Flash Gordon is going nowhere, one of my favorite pins. So great. Really under appreciated IMHO. I can't think of a single ball pin I like more. I really love the early 80s Ballys, have Flash Gordon and Mystic, and a Fathom on loan. I have space for 10 pins but I only list 9 since I don't own the Fathom. If I can find a Medusa I'll sell my Abra Ca Dabra to fit it next to Mystic in my office.

This is genius level thinkin' right here ..... Read above.

#1284 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I don't think Andrew likes it either. But I can understand why he did it. Frankly the climate when Alien was announced in pinball was pretty different. It felt like if you didn't throw your card into the ring people were going to commit all their pinball funds to other pre-orders.

I can understand the thinking, but boy, when you think about it, how messed up the whole "pre-order pinball mania" was. All this money sucked up for games that may never see the light of day. Heighway is at Expo 2014 with a Full Throttle prototype, but that was yesterday's news already, so the arms race meant you had to announce something else.

It will be better for everyone when that is over with.

#1285 3 years ago

On the subject of 'classic horror movies' like Alien, does anyone like the original Poltergeist movie? I still think it stands up as a masterpiece. Maybe a theme for a pinball?????

#1286 3 years ago

Yall have no idea of what this thread is doing to me... I have plans! I can't break my plans!

#1287 3 years ago
Quoted from jackSparrow:

On the subject of 'classic horror movies' like Alien, does anyone like the original Poltergeist movie?

Right up there with some of my favorite films of all time, I was born in 74 so the 80's sci/fi and horror films will always have a special connection with me and I don't know what it is but even with all the HD and CGI etc. I find these films to be much more authentic, not sure why? I would rather watch Close encounters than most modern alien films or Poltergiest to the trash horror films of today. JMO

#1288 3 years ago
Quoted from MK6PIN:

All good...it will come, and no need for a frenzy....

I know, but thanks for saying it. I don't think "pinball is hard" is the right saying. Pinball takes time. Pinball is complicated. It's hard when you don't know what you're doing. It's hard to predict. But Heighway has a great team and a great factory. In the end that's what will matter when it comes to building everyone a rad game. And Alien will be game 2, all the lessons learned from doing Full Throttle means they're a little bit wiser now!

Quoted from frolic:

I can understand the thinking, but boy, when you think about it, how messed up the whole "pre-order pinball mania" was. All this money sucked up for games that may never see the light of day. Heighway is at Expo 2014 with a Full Throttle prototype, but that was yesterday's news already, so the arms race meant you had to announce something else.

Exactly. That's a dead on description.

The stuff with Jpop and Kevin really sucks. But their implosions really were rather small in the grand scheme of things. I'm hoping some sanity has returned with the bubble being pricked, not torn wide open. Maybe the hobby will be healthier for it. A real medieval bleeding. I know some of that blood was yours man, and that sucks. BTW I haven't forgotten about my PM to you.

Quoted from Classic_Stern:

This is genius level thinkin' right here .....

Tell you what man, I love pinball in so many ways. The 1980 Bally games make my heart beat faster. Just seeing them makes me happy. They're just right, the art, the sounds, the rules, the gameplay: just a real raw simplicity that's still extra challenging to actually master, and keeps you coming back. I keep my games on 5 ball, and the games still fly by in a 4 player match. Especially on my Flash Gordon!

But I also love what modern tech is giving us. Andrew, I'm gonna just spit a little hype out here, I'm not giving anything away, just talking about what we *could* do with the tech your company is letting me play with!

(The following is just a hypothetical for the moment, making it up on the spot, the team can steal it if they want, but not saying it will be in the game.)

We have a playfield where every single light both on top of and below it is a fully addressable RGB light (plus if you upgrade or have the LE there's fiberoptic ramp lighting, same color changing abilities). There's a high rez LCD screen right in the middle of that.

We kill all the GI and the inserts and the LCD. Game goes dark.

A rumbling explosion builds on the sound system, and the LCD lights up with a fireball. The screen goes red. A "shockwave" of red travels outwards from the screen as the inserts and GI all bloom into red in sequence as it moves away from the center. The beacons start spinning. The flashers start going off, red of course.

Man, I dunno what Andrew is gonna do here, but the man says he's going to offer an optional game-activated smoke machine. If you have one it would let out a big puff of smoke, right as the screen animates.

The game is bathed in red, the inserts fade out and flashers go off, so just the red GI remains, keep the beacons going though, and then we ... who knows? Launch a 4 ball multiball. Light up all the major shot arrows red. Every time you hit one it goes orange (and all the flashers orange). Then yellow. Then you extinguish it. Put out all the shots to light the super jackpots.

I dunno, I'm making this up right now, and the rules are all covered by Bálint and team. Just an example for the kinds of thinking I hope we bring to the game. But I'm working with the game designers and programmers to figure out stuff like that. It's this enormously cool playground. I'm honestly just as excited about art directing the LCD screens and the lighting as I am about the cabinet/playfield art.

So my point is, I love Flash Gordon and Mystic, but I love the new level of immersive-ness we're going to be able to bring to a game that's begging to have the atmospheres of the films. It's awesome that at a fundamental level they're both just games to bat the ball around. And yet they're real generations apart.

Flash Gordon is balls out hard, a drain monster with wild balls even when you hit the shot you were trying to (#^¢%ing inline drops). You're just lighting up the spinners and multipliers, that's the whole game for the most part. It's super basic. But it's so damn fun.
Alien will have multiple modes and multiballs and outside of mode things, full screen animations, all this insane lighting (though they'll both have interactive backbox lighting!). Just a totally different experience.
I've got secrets about the lighting that I won't even share, you'll have to see it in person and hopefully the ideas work!

Sorry man. Sort of just piled on there a little bit.

#1289 3 years ago

Damnit, quoted instead of editing. I write too much, I know, sorry.

#1290 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I write too much

I wouldn't have thought so. Only 14,489 posts in 3yrs on Pinside. You need to be posting a lot more.

#1291 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Tell you what man, I love pinball in so many ways. The 1980 Bally games make my heart beat faster. Just seeing them makes me happy. They're just right, the art, the sounds, the rules, the gameplay: just a real raw simplicity that's still extra challenging to actually master, and keeps you coming back. I keep my games on 5 ball, and the games still fly by in a 4 player match. Especially on my Flash Gordon!

You are correct Sir.

#1292 3 years ago
Quoted from WIKED:

I wouldn't have thought so. Only 14,489 posts in 3yrs on Pinside. You need to be posting a lot more.

I work from home. My wife is at work, my kids are at camp. Or, my kids and wife are asleep and I'm sitting here working, I'm a night owl. Either way I'm used to talking to people all day through the keyboard. Email, the Ars IRC channels, various IM and texting, etc.

Pinside is my non-work water cooler, where I don't have to think about doing a native Porsche piece, or working on a pitch to Microsoft. Don't get me wrong, the big clients are great, it's fun to work on a campaign for a brand that's looking for original thinking and willing to do what it takes to execute it. But look how fast I'm slipping into talking like I'm back at work.

So yeah, I need a place to chat with people that's a mental break from that. Pinball is a great outlet, because the community is awesome – warts and all, I love it – but also because playing pinball is how I relax.

#1293 3 years ago

Buying into thin air promises is beyond ridiculous these days. Would be nice for a company to actually build something BEFORE they ask you for a ton of money.

Soon, you will have to pay customers to stand in line waiting the eons it takes for these things to actually be available to play.

#1294 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

(The following is just a hypothetical for the moment, making it up on the spot, the team can steal it if they want, but not saying it will be in the game.)
We have a playfield where every single light both on top of and below it is a fully addressable RGB light (plus if you upgrade or have the LE there's fiberoptic ramp lighting, same color changing abilities). There's a high rez LCD screen right in the middle of that.
We kill all the GI and the inserts and the LCD. Game goes dark.
A rumbling explosion builds on the sound system, and the LCD lights up with a fireball. The screen goes red. A "shockwave" of red travels outwards from the screen as the inserts and GI all bloom into red in sequence as it moves away from the center. The beacons start spinning. The flashers start going off, red of course.
Man, I dunno what Andrew is gonna do here, but the man says he's going to offer an optional game-activated smoke machine. If you have one it would let out a big puff of smoke, right as the screen animates.
The game is bathed in red, the inserts fade out and flashers go off, so just the red GI remains, keep the beacons going though, and then we ... who knows? Launch a 4 ball multiball. Light up all the major shot arrows red. Every time you hit one it goes orange (and all the flashers orange). Then yellow. Then you extinguish it. Put out all the shots to light the super jackpots.
I dunno, I'm making this up right now, and the rules are all covered by Bálint and team. Just an example for the kinds of thinking I hope we bring to the game. But I'm working with the game designers and programmers to figure out stuff like that. It's this enormously cool playground. I'm honestly just as excited about art directing the LCD screens and the lighting as I am about the cabinet/playfield art.

Seriously what an absolute pleasure to read, such exciting possibilities .Yes part of me wants my Alien pin ASAP but a much larger part of me wants the kind of experience as described above

More than willing to wait and allow time for this baby to evolve and fulfil its true potential. The Alien licence is just that special, both from a fans point of view and commercially for a manufacturer

For me the regular comms from Heighway and the little insights from Aurich are making it dam fun being able to check in on this thread and get a little fix .

After saying that. Hurry up

#1295 3 years ago

So when did the LE jump in price from $7850 to $8050? Why the price increase? Will we see this upward trend in pricing continue as the game gets closer to production? I was visiting heighway's site to pre-order after Aurich's awesome post above but now I am a bit put off by a price increase with no new significant information about the game revealed. What gives guys?

#1296 3 years ago

Since price has been mentioned, what was up with the "show pricing" at Pintastic for Full Throttle? Will we start seeing "show pricing" for Aliens?

#1297 3 years ago

I can only speculate that the price creep has to do with the fact that the game has changed since first announced.

Speaks back to the point that it will be a better situation when game announcements are not made so early.

#1298 3 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

I can only speculate that the price creep has to do with the fact that the game has changed since first announced.
Speaks back to the point that it will be a better situation when game announcements are not made so early.

UGHHH! I hate to get on a soapbox, but here goes. What has changed about this game? There has been no significant reveal of any changes to a game that was supposed to have been in production 3 months ago. Don't get me wrong. I get it. Motion Picture IP holders are hard to work with. You can stop drilling that into my head now. My beef is that the price is creeping up on a game that has had ZERO visually revealed! So, should I expect a new price increase every time that a feature of this game is verbally described to me?

#1299 3 years ago
Quoted from jazzmaster:

UGHHH! I hate to get on a soapbox, but here goes. What has changed about this game? There has been no significant reveal of any changes to a game that was supposed to have been in production 3 months ago. Don't get me wrong. I get it. Motion Picture IP holders are hard to work with. You can stop drilling that into my head now. My beef is that the price is creeping up on a game that has had ZERO visually revealed! So, should I expect a new price increase every time that a feature of this game is verbally described to me?

Second LCD in backbox might be standard now?

#1300 3 years ago
Quoted from nephasth:

Second LCD in backbox might be standard now?

not sure...I know the second LCD is an upcharge (which I approved), but can't speculate beyond that...I'm sure Andrew will provide clarity...might be better to directly ask him....he's always been quick and forthcoming w responses......

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