Los Angeles, CA
Quoted from TomGWI:I think GB plays off to people because it is not similar to anything out there.
Exactly. Everything else out there is designed well. 
(Topic ID: 184200)
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Aerosmith (Pro)
Stern, 2017
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Quoted from CrazyLevi:Aerosmith is super fun but why is this a surprise to anybody?
Theme. People get excited about theme first. If they love the theme, they'll play a shitty game like GoatF'rs and be happy with it. With Aerosmith, people aren't too hyped on the theme - so when the game is fun, they're surprised since they didn't have any expectations or interest.
Quoted from TomGWI:No you just can't adapt to change.
Sure I can, if it's fun! 
Quoted from PanzerFreak:I hear ya there. I think Ghostbusters layout is one of the coolest things about the game as its so unique. How many games have we had with the typical left ramp / right ramp that return directly to the flippers and 2 orbits combo? Tons. They are cool but after a while they all start to play the same way.
There's unique, and then there's poor design!
Giant flipper gap = poor design
Droopy flippers = poor design
All the catapult of death airballs = poor design
Inlane-to-outlane hops of death = poor design
Balls not smoothly returning from left orbits, ricocheting slightly & going STDM = poor design
Balls exiting pops and usually going STDM = poor design
Balls shooting out of saucer STDM = poor design
Slimer always being broken on location = poor design
Prem/LE right ramp often stopping the ball halfway up, then sending it back = poor design
Modes as linear ladders = poor design
Unique doesn't = good if it plays like shit. Wanna play a GOOD unique layout!? Try Wheel of Fortune! Nordman did something super unique with that game, and despite it's incomplete code, it's a fantastic playing original non-fan game!
Quoted from TomGWI:{Steve Ritchie said Play Better}
Sure. On a well-designed Steve Ritchie game "Play better" means nothing on GB, as it f*cks excellent players due to it's terrible design.
Quoted from TomGWI:{I have played 5 Ghostbusters and not one of them these things. My guess it was the way it was leveled or setup}
I've played about 20 of them...same on every single one. Pro/Prem/LE.
Quoted from TomGWI:{Code}
Ladders are on the playfield. I'll blame the designer for locking the coder into the concept. 
Quoted from frankmac:MET = Top Shelf.
GB = Sold it.
Aerosmith = Wow!!
BM66 = I wanted so much more !
You are someone everyone should trust when it comes to pinball. 
Quoted from NimblePin:It's like Rare accidentally won Paul Bunyan's axe on eBay and is stuck grinding that mo-fo well into 2025.
It's my schtick!
Quoted from NimblePin:Hearing that he played 20 GB's and hated them all just tells me 20 people didn't know how (or cared enough,) to set up their GB...
Why is it such a consistent out-of-the-box garbage game? Sure all games can benefit from tweaks, but I've never seen another title that blows on multiple levels out of the box? Even if I played a "good one" - linear modes, poor DMD art, and other general unpleasantries still kill
it.
Quoted from Eskaybee:I dunno man, for every 10 people who love this pin like 20 hate it. and when I say 20 hate it, I mean rare hero is so vocal about it, he counts as 20
LOL. Sure, I'll count for 20! At least 20 people have told me they hate it - but they keep it to themselves. Pinball PC, I suppose!
Quoted from NimblePin:I specifically took the time to set up the LE at Banning just in case Rare showed up
You could have just asked me before spending the time. I was in San Diego with my lady, sitting by a pool eating vegan donuts and playing Zelda.
Quoted from silver_spinner:Giant flipper gap = poor design (cftbl has this and people seem to accept it)
Irrelevant. It's bigger on GB, geometry is totally different, and CFTBL isn't a game with a ton of story based modes...the rules are much simpler and one doesn't feel cheated if they have a crap game. Look, I love Congo, and Congo has the "Trudeau gap"...on that game, with that geometry, and those rules - it works. Design & code have to work in harmony. GB's design doesn't work well with it's style of content.
Back to Aerosmith! IT'S GRETA!!!!!
Quoted from T7:Over the top on your Anti-GB Agenda???
It's my schtick now! I'm committed.
Quoted from T7:---- The following are simply NOT TRUE - at most only require a small adjustment ----
Wait which one is it? If it's not true, it wouldn't need an adjustment. They are true, I've experienced it on every GB I've played.
Quoted from T7:Finally - you use WoF as an example of an excellently designed game????
Yes, Nordman is a consistently great designer. Say what you will about the theme or how the code was left...WOF plays great.
Quoted from T7:Even though they are minor issues, they do have a large impact on the fun of the game. Sooooooo - just spend the 1 hour + $80 and fix them!!!!
Every game needing multiple "fixes" to be quasi playable= bad design. I'm glad you were able to fix Trudeau's errors to enjoy the game...but after Insertgate and my personal experience on tons of machines all being negative...plus hating the linear modes & DMD approach - the aftermarket fixes don't save this game for me. I'm done fixing NIB games, especially at the current prices. I was under the hood SO F*CKING MUCH on Avengers, Xmen, Transformers ....so, this is nothing new - I'm just over it.
Quoted from Trekkie1978:Side note: I've put a lot of time on Congo, really fun game, I never realized it had a wider gap until it was pointed out on this thread.
All Trudeau's have it...but GB's is even larger than his other games. I've been told by multiple sources that this was a mistake...but it was caught too late to fix it. So - anyone putting center posts or longer flippers shouldn't feel guilty for "not playing as intended". You're fixing a mistake. 
Quoted from T7:Agreed, if the opinion is stated 10-20 times or so. I only used the term since RH has got to be into triple digit posts on this one, and the criticisms are pretty extreme: G***F****s - LOL.
While I do legitimately believe that GB is one of the worst games I've ever played...I'll totally admit to kinda trolling at this point. Maybe I'll get banned and start a podcast.
I guess I should go seek out an Aerosmith to play....oh, but Zelda calls!!!
Quoted from musketd:So I just can't stop playing this game it really is a game changer and the best game stern has put out in a long time; it just put FUN.
In what way is it a game changer? I mean...yeah, if it's fun, that's awesome...but what's it going to do to change the game? It's a pretty standard layout...we've already seen Donny art, so - that's not new. Theme seems to be love it or leave it. Are the rules Lyman/Keith level?
Quoted from pinbum:It's FUN that's all that matters, some people don't get a boner about beating the wizard modes and the ruleset.
Did I say anything about a wizard mode? These are games. Rules are important. If the rules are bad and/or unfinished, the game is bad and/or unfinished. From Derek's review, it sounds like the game has good rules! That's good. I'm just wondering why it's a "game changer". That's quite a statement.
Quoted from Rob_G:IM doesn't have deep rules, yet a lot of people seem to like it. I am contemplating either getting a colordmd for my IMVE or selling IMVE and getting AS. I think with IM that given the simpler rules, it's too bad the final wizard mode is unobtainable to most.
Rob
Depth is never the issue. A complete vision is. Problems with recent Stern games are incompleteness and inconsistent gelling of playfield & rules. Not depth. Iron Man is perfect because the rules are awesome and fit the playfield & theme perfectly.
1 week later
Quoted from musketd:Just a quick update guys this game has it all it's pure fun and so far is the best game of this year; it kicks ass
Alrighty D - I put about an hour on Aero Pro today. I enjoyed it! I'm not as gaga as you are, but it left a good first impression. It's pretty much what I thought it would be - a smooth playing Borg "best of". Rules seemed straight forward. I like how you can risk your multiball to add more balls to it. Screen was more impressive than I thought it would be. Good mix of 2D assets and cel-shaded 3D for Jacky. He character animation is a little too "Archer" for my tastes, but for a pinball display it's fine and its all cohesive.
Mind wasn't blown, but I'll take tried and true if it's fun. Don't see myself buying one, but if I was in the market for a new Stern, this would be the one I'd consider.
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