Adding a powered sub inside the cabinet?

(Topic ID: 200361)

Adding a powered sub inside the cabinet?


By Luckydogg420

1 year ago



Topic Stats

  • 17 posts
  • 10 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by markmon
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

One image has been uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

CAM00866 (resized).jpg

#1 1 year ago

Has anyone done this before? I’m thinking about a modern Stern (I own GoT). How difficult would it be to remove the base cabinet speaker and install a powered sub in its place? You could use the existing speaker wire, install an amp and new speaker and your good to go; right? It could be plugged into the service outlet or tapped in, to get power from the game.

Would it be better to leave the original cabinet speaker and add a 2nd speaker (powered sub) into the back of the pin. Either cut a new hole for the 2nd speaker or use an in-wall induction speaker that mounts onto the cabinet. If it’s just for bass sound quality shouldn’t be to much of an issue.

What about upgrading the stock speakers to a flipper fidelity package. Would that be enough that you wouldn’t want to add an external sub.

#2 1 year ago

I've found the best way is just add an external sub and place underneath the game. Run wires through back, attach alligator clips and done. I would not invest in another sub to be place in cabinet, I don't think the cabinets are properly suited to give quality sound with a free air sub. When you're done with game, simply remove the wires and move to the next one.

These seem to be real popular with the pinball community.

amazon.com link »

#3 1 year ago
Quoted from sparechange1974:

I've found the best way is just add an external sub and place underneath the game. Run wires through back, attach alligator clips and done. I would not invest in another sub to be place in cabinet, I don't think the cabinets are properly suited to give quality sound with a free air sub. When you're done with game, simply remove the wires and move to the next one.
These seem to be real popular with the pinball community.
amazon.com link »

this is correct and you can usually Run 2 games off one sub

#4 1 year ago

You put a powered sub touching the cabinet it's going to be shaker city. Most people do external

#5 1 year ago
Quoted from Luckydogg420:

Has anyone done this before? I’m thinking about a modern Stern (I own GoT). How difficult would it be to remove the base cabinet speaker and install a powered sub in its place? You could use the existing speaker wire, install an amp and new speaker and your good to go; right? It could be plugged into the service outlet or tapped in, to get power from the game.
Would it be better to leave the original cabinet speaker and add a 2nd speaker (powered sub) into the back of the pin. Either cut a new hole for the 2nd speaker or use an in-wall induction speaker that mounts onto the cabinet. If it’s just for bass sound quality shouldn’t be to much of an issue.
What about upgrading the stock speakers to a flipper fidelity package. Would that be enough that you wouldn’t want to add an external sub.

The answer is yes, the Flipper Fidelity 10" package is enough that you won't care about a powered sub. I've installed a lot of Pinball Pro and Flipper Fidelity kits. Have also done some do-it-yourself speaker upgrades (coax speakers plus woofer with crossover and L-pad). I've done the external powered sub thing too. Mostly WPC, but some SAM, Whitestar, WPC-95 and Spike as well. So far, my experience has been that the Flipper Fidelity packages are fantastic in Spike and WPC-95 games. You would probably be delighted with the Flipper Fidelity 10" kit in a GOT. I installed one in my Ghostbusters and it's well worth it.

#6 1 year ago
Quoted from sparechange1974:

I've found the best way is just add an external sub and place underneath the game. Run wires through back, attach alligator clips and done. I would not invest in another sub to be place in cabinet, I don't think the cabinets are properly suited to give quality sound with a free air sub. When you're done with game, simply remove the wires and move to the next one.
These seem to be real popular with the pinball community.
amazon.com link »

I understand that this is the easiest way to add some bass, but I’m not keen on having a sub on the floor under the pin. I’d prefer an option enclosed in the game.

Quoted from TheLaw:

You put a powered sub touching the cabinet it's going to be shaker city. Most people do external

I have a shaker on my game and I guarantee you that no speaker would move a cabinet as much as a shaker motor does. Unless of course it’s a 15” sub playing a loud 20hrz signal. Music playing bass wouldn’t have as noticeable of an effect as a shaker motor.

Quoted from Paul_from_Gilroy:

The answer is yes, the Flipper Fidelity 10" package is enough that you won't care about a powered sub. I've installed a lot of Pinball Pro and Flipper Fidelity kits. Have also done some do-it-yourself speaker upgrades (coax speakers plus woofer with crossover and L-pad). I've done the external powered sub thing too. Mostly WPC, but some SAM, Whitestar, WPC-95 and Spike as well. So far, my experience has been that the Flipper Fidelity packages are fantastic in Spike and WPC-95 games. You would probably be delighted with the Flipper Fidelity 10" kit in a GOT. I installed one in my Ghostbusters and it's well worth it.

So the flipper fidelity package is a huge upgrade over the stock speakers, but is it as noticeable as a sub on the floor? My stock speakers are loud enough for the room, but I’d prefer a more full sound with rich deep bass.

#7 1 year ago

Putting one in the cabinet will cause the glass to vibrate and make horrible noises.

The thing I dont like about the Flipper Fidelity kit is that it really taxes the games amp that was not designed to push that much power. I heard a fun house that had the speakers installed and the amp was getting so hot it was shutting down. The reccomend you use their speakers with a Pinsound board. Well all said and done your going to have +$400 into it, or you could just spend the 100 on the external sub and throw it under the caibnet.

Or you can take that sub apart and use its amp and speaker in your cabinet. No guarantee it will sound any good but you could do it.

#8 1 year ago

Your not going to get rich deep bass from mounting a sub inside the cabinet. A pinball cabinet isn’t really a good enclosure to give you acoustics like a external sub will do.

#9 1 year ago
Quoted from Pugsley:

Putting one in the cabinet will cause the glass to vibrate and make horrible noises.

OP doesnt seem to agree

#10 1 year ago
Quoted from Luckydogg420:

I understand that this is the easiest way to add some bass, but I’m not keen on having a sub on the floor under the pin. I’d prefer an option enclosed in the game.

So the flipper fidelity package is a huge upgrade over the stock speakers, but is it as noticeable as a sub on the floor? My stock speakers are loud enough for the room, but I’d prefer a more full sound with rich deep bass.

The FF speakers for the back box are an upgrade from stock, on the newer systems(GOT) the difference isn't that noticeable in my opinion as compared to other games. The sub in the cabinet will never be as good as stand alone powered under cab. The boxes they come in are specifically designed to maximize sound unlike the pinball cab full of hardware. The FF subs are a major upgrade from stock and you will notice the difference. With some anti-rattle tape you could take care of most of the vibration if you decide to go sub in cabinet. There are trade offs either way

#11 1 year ago

Seeing you don't like the idea of a sub on the floor and just adding after market speakers can really tax the amp on sound board and cause all sorts of issues. So...why not consider the set up that Spooky Pinball has been using with pretty good success. -Pinball Pro speakers being pushed by this Lepai amp. This is a pretty good setup that is used on my AMH and RZ. Just food for thought.
-Mike

CAM00866 (resized).jpg

#12 1 year ago

I have Flipper Fidelity in Metallica- sounds good. and Pinball Pro in MB - sounds good but when turned halfway up vibrates the machine and glass. Also when in the game the sub faces the floor so it doesn't sound as good. I have a Polk sub - don't like the look of it under the machine ....but if you tuck it under a little it's fine and sounds a whole lot better and can be turned up louder with no issues. Also the Polk can run 2 games and cost about a hundred bucks.

#13 1 year ago
Quoted from Pugsley:

Putting one in the cabinet will cause the glass to vibrate and make horrible noises.

Oh, I agree that the glass may rattle, but noting like a shaker motor will do. IMHO

Quoted from Pugsley:

Or you can take that sub apart and use its amp and speaker in your cabinet. No guarantee it will sound any good but you could do it.

I built a virtual pin from scratch and used a 2.1 plate amp with 2 coax speakers and a sub in the bottom of the cabinet. That worked out well. I didn’t notice and glass rattle; although I do currently hear the glass in Game of Thrones when the shaker goes off. (Maybe my build quality is better then Sterns)
http://hyperspin-fe.com/forums/topic/2340-mortal-pinball-kombat-a-build-thread/

Quoted from PinRob:

Your not going to get rich deep bass from mounting a sub inside the cabinet. A pinball cabinet isn’t really a good enclosure to give you acoustics like a external sub will do.

This is very true. For great sound you need to have an enclosure tuned for your speaker. I have great sound from my home theater, this is just pinball. It could be better but I’m not hoping for anything to spectacular.

Quoted from sparechange1974:

The sub in the cabinet will never be as good as stand alone powered under cab

Ok. I agree that a stand alone sub would sound the best. ( but for sake of argument let’s say that a sub on the floor won’t work for this location)

Quoted from Grizlyrig:

Seeing you don't like the idea of a sub on the floor and just adding after market speakers can really tax the amp on sound board and cause all sorts of issues.

I always thought that FF systems came with an additional amp to power them. If not then they’re outta the question. What’s their special sauce? Just A crossover?

I think that it would work fairly well and could sound much better then original. Just by adding a powered amp like Spooky Pinball does and swapping out the cabinet speaker with a matched sub. Something with a variable crossover so that you could tune it to sound best for the game it’s in.

#14 1 year ago

TNA has a ported sub in the cabinet and it doesn't rattle itself to pieces.

#15 1 year ago
Quoted from Pugsley:

Putting one in the cabinet will cause the glass to vibrate and make horrible noises.

only if it’s loose. Anti rattle tape or electrical tape solves this.

Quoted from Pugsley:

The thing I dont like about the Flipper Fidelity kit is that it really taxes the games amp that was not designed to push that much power. I heard a fun house that had the speakers installed and the amp was getting so hot it was shutting down.

This is generally false information also. As long as the speaker impedance is a match and the woofer efficiently is good then there are no issues “taxing” the internal amp.

Unfortunately many Williams games come wires improperly and over the years a 20 year old amp cannot handle the load and wears out. This is especially true on pre-dcs games.

A TDA 2020 in the pinball boards is plenty of power to drive the efficient 8 or 10 inch speakers.

#16 1 year ago

You could box in the sub in the cabinet to get it tuned if there is room. or you could attach the complete sub to the bottom of the cabinet so its off the floor.

#17 1 year ago
Quoted from Pugsley:

You could box in the sub in the cabinet to get it tuned if there is room. or you could attach the complete sub to the bottom of the cabinet so its off the floor.

FYI, there is no benefit to adding a box to the speaker. In fact you will get much deeper bass in the cabinet than if it were in a box.

Quoted from Luckydogg420:

This is very true. For great sound you need to have an enclosure tuned for your speaker. I have great sound from my home theater, this is just pinball. It could be better but I’m not hoping for anything to spectacular.

I always thought that FF systems came with an additional amp to power them. If not then they’re outta the question. What’s their special sauce? Just A crossover?
I think that it would work fairly well and could sound much better then original. Just by adding a powered amp like Spooky Pinball does and swapping out the cabinet speaker with a matched sub. Something with a variable crossover so that you could tune it to sound best for the game it’s in.

A box tuned speaker does not necessarily sound better. The cabinet in this case acts as an infinite baffle which allows much deeper frequency bass than you’d get from a boxed speaker. Also the flipper fidelity does not need an amp. A crossover and a properly efficient speaker does absolutely great driven by the tda2020 amp in our pinballs.

Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
$ 99.99
Lighting - Other
Lighted Pinball Mods
From: € 189.00
Displays
GermanGamingSupplies.com
$ 11.95
Trade
Machine - For Trade
Tampa, FL
$ 22.00
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
ModFather Pinball Mods
$ 79.99
$ 48.00
Cabinet - Other
ModFather Pinball Mods
$ 10.00
Playfield - Decals
Mods for your pinballs
From: $ 40.00
Cabinet - Other
Rock Custom Pinball
From: $ 20.00
Cabinet - Other
Rock Custom Pinball
$ 22.00
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
ModFather Pinball Mods
$ 25.00
From: $ 23.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ModFather Pinball Mods
$ 10.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ModFather Pinball Mods
$ 45.00
Cabinet - Other
Rock Custom Pinball
From: $ 99.00
Lighting - Under Cabinet
Rock Custom Pinball
From: $ 40.00
Cabinet - Other
Rock Custom Pinball
$ 22.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ModFather Pinball Mods
$ 16.00
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
ModFather Pinball Mods
$ 7.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ModFather Pinball Mods
5,995
Machine - For Sale
Milford, CT
$ 15.00
Cabinet - Decals
ModFather Pinball Mods
$ 11.95
From: $ 99.99
Cabinet - Other
Lighted Pinball Mods
Great pinball charity
Pinball Edu

Hey there! Got a moment?

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside