Addam&#039;s Family: pinball missing and no lights on playfield

I would start by checking all of the voltages at the PDB. Skip the upper GI stuff.

PDB.gif

#3 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

Thanks for the reply!

I have looked at the power board, I am not pretty sure of where/how to check the voltage on it... the only position where I could immagine to put my tester is on fusibles and on ground somewhere... but I prefer not to try it..

I have checked the leds and all of them are turned on and off exactly like the manual says they shold be.
I have checked fusibles again with the tester (I have not removed them to do that), and all of them are not broken.

Could you give me some suggestions more?

#4 8 years ago

HEY

indypinhead

Pinside member

12y 119K 6,376

Sometimes the ball gets hung up in the swamp shot....under the playfield.

Turn the game on....and give the machine a good shake or 2.

#5 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

All three balls where in place, I have also removed them and tried to put them in other holes but nothing happens: it will not kick them out, lights and kick actions seems to be dead.

#6 8 years ago

TAB

terryb

Inactive member

OP
Quoted from Faz:
I have looked at the power board, I am not pretty sure of where/how to check the voltage on it... the only position where I could immagine to put my tester is on fusibles and on ground somewhere... but I prefer not to try it..

That's fine. I'm not sure where else to go though. If the led's on the PDB are on then theoretically you have power (not a guarantee though). You've checked the cpu led's and they look good. Fuses check good.

Yet you have no solenoids, lights and possibly switches. Really sounds like power or connector.

If you post your location maybe someone nearby can give you a hand check the voltages.

Just to confirm you did check the solenoids and flashers with the coin door closed?

#7 8 years ago

MAC

wantdataeast

Inactive member

Same thing happened to me, it was a problem with my center though switch.

#8 8 years ago

HEY

indypinhead

Pinside member

12y 119K 6,376

Try re-seating your connectors on all the boards...also push on any chips that are in sockets.

#9 8 years ago

MAC

wantdataeast

Inactive member

Here is what was wrong with mine with the missing pinball problem.

3 things were out
-Center through switch (causing the pinball missing)
-left slingshot
-right outlane

they all had one thing in common, all of them were tied to the blue and white wire. so I traced it back up toward the head and sure enough found a break in the blue and white wire circuit.

So check your errors vs. the switch matrix and see if you can find a commonality in the wire circuit.

Bally_Addams_Family_16-9317-2_Switch-matrix.jpg

#10 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

Thank you very much for your support, I write from Italy,

I have coin door open, but this is the first time I have this kind of problem.
How can I check the solenoids and flashers with the coin door closed?

I have already tried to "move" all cable connectors from the electronic boards, all seems to fit well.
I can try to push chips.

What is the "center though switch" ?

How can I "read"/understand the switch matrix?

Thanks!

#11 8 years ago

MJS

schudel5

Pinside member

20y 166K 6,398 27

Some later games (after 1993) have a switch behind the coin door that prevents high voltage coils and flashers from working with the coin door open. Addams Family does not have this switch. The coils and flashers work with the door open.

The suggestions they are trying to have you do is eliminate any bad connections there may be. Reseating all the connectors including the ribbon cables and socketed chips can often get things working again.

The center trough switch is located at the bottom of the playfield where the balls end up when they drain. There are 3 switches in the trough, one for each ball. They are having you look at the center switch. Look for a broken wire or diode not soldered to the switch. You can go into diagnosis on the game and go to switch edge tests to do further testing of the switches.

The switch matrix is a way to arrange switches in an 8x8 grid to allow 64 switches and only use 8 + 8 or 16 wires to the CPU. The switches are arranged in rows and columns by common wire colors. If you have multiple issues with switches, look at the matrix. Typically these end up being on either the same row or column clueing you in to where to look.

#12 8 years ago

MAC

wantdataeast

Inactive member

Quoted from schudel5:
The center trough switch is located at the bottom of the playfield where the balls end up when they drain. There are 3 switches in the trough, one for each ball. They are having you look at the center switch. Look for a broken wire or diode not soldered to the switch. You can go into diagnosis on the game and go to switch edge tests to do further testing of the switches.

The center through is the ball in the middle as you look at all three of them sitting there

Quoted from schudel5:
The switch matrix is a way to arrange switches in an 8x8 grid to allow 64 switches and only use 8 + 8 or 16 wires to the CPU. The switches are arranged in rows and columns by common wire colors. If you have multiple issues with switches, look at the matrix. Typically these end up being on either the same row or column clueing you in to where to look.

Yep, in my case the wire (blue/white) was connected perfectly fine at the center through switch, but as I traced that wire up toward the MPU board, I discovered it where the same wire was used further up there was a break.

So use your diagnostic mode to tests all your switches in the machine. write them all down. Then look at the switch matrix diagram and see if there is any commonality.... like in my case all 3 things that had failed were connected by a blue / white wire.

You also have a lamp matrix to use as reference, to check for out lamps as well.

If you do not have the Addams family manual here is one:
http://pinball.thewolfden.org/TAF/manual/Addams_Family_PARTS.pdf

#13 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

Thanks again!

I checked again, I have pushed chips in sockets, nothing changes.

When I power on the Addam's, the test returns these errros:

Check switch 31 (Upper left jet)
Check switch 32 (Upper right jet)
Check switch 33 (Center left jet)
Check switch 34 (Center right jet)
Check switch 61 (Left Ramp enter)
Piball Missing
Check Thing Up Opto (S-85)
Check Thing Down Opto (S-84)

So I have made a switch test and all three switches in the bottom, where balls wait to be used, are working: on and off state is detected right.

I have also checked other switchs by manually activate them and all of them seems to work. All switches detected as bad in the start test, seems to work too: on and off is detected.
The center left jet switch is the only one that does not detect on-off state.

All the four Flippers work too.

Things start to fail with the above items:

Flasher Test
Gen'L Illum.
Bookcase
Thing Motor

All of these do nothing, the playfield seems dead.
A connector, a cable or a fusible should be broken... but where?

I am tring to find a common cable... but what should I do when I find it?

How can I test fuses? Should I remove them to test one by one?

Can I safely place my tester on each one of them to check voltage?

Thanks

#14 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

So... for things that do not work like solenoids, it seems that they are all connected to violet-XXcolor wire, and all these wires refers to connector J130 on the Power Board. That should be the so called HighPower line.

But other things not working are connected to low power J127 connector using Brown-XXcolor wires.
Flashers are using Black-XXcolor wires and are going to J126 - J125.
Other are going to J122 using Blu-XXcolor wires.

J120 and J212 connectors are used for general illumination, all of them have a different color cable: Brown, Orange, Yellow and Violet.

So I suppose that not all these connectors and wires could be broken at once.

May be powerboard is failing somewhere even if the fuses seems good and the status led are on and off like manual tells they shoul be.

So the only thing I can do seems to check fuses F104 to F112 that are all related to the items not working in the game.

I would also try to check Tilt sensors, the playfield is "dead" when in tilt, may be one of them is "closed" ?

Do you have any other suggestion?

thanks!

#15 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

So, I have removed all fuses and checked them again: all fuses are ok.

Than I have checked again each connector, removed and plugged in again on the electronic boards.

Then I have rechecked the power board leds, and they are powered on and off in the right way.

Then I have checked the undertable wires and switches: all seems ok but I have found a broken diode on the shooter lane switch, so I have resoldered it and in this way I have removed some of the errors about jets detected at start up.
Other errors stay there.

Now I am lost... I have no idea of what else I could try.

Is someone able to give me more suggestion about how to check things again?

thanks!

#16 8 years ago

TAB

terryb

Inactive member

Can you check for power at one of the solenoids--that may be something you're more comfortable with than testing on the board?

Test voltage from either side of the coil to ground. You could use an alligator clip to bring the test points out of the game, just don't let them touch each other or any ground.

OP
Quoted from Faz:
I am tring to find a common cable... but what should I do when I find it?

The puzzling part is there really aren't any commonalities between the GI and the flashers/solenoids.

#17 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

Thanks!

I have checked the voltage of a couple of solenoids and it says 50V ... so even the power seems to be ok... what else could make things stop working?

#18 8 years ago

MAC

wantdataeast

Inactive member

I am guessing here but want this video and pay attention to the 2:00 mark.

#19 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

Thanks, I am not pretty sure of what that man says at 2:00 mark, it seems he was talking about blow switch line... but my switchs are working... Do I understand well?

#20 8 years ago

TAB

terryb

Inactive member

OP
Quoted from Faz:
Thanks, I am not pretty sure of what that man says at 2:00 mark, it seems he was talking about blow switch line... but my switchs are working... Do I understand well?

You've got it right. He says that if you short the lamp circuit to a switch circuit you can blow it, but as you previously stated all of your switches are working, but the solenoids/flashers/GI are not.

So if you have 50 volts at the solenoids then it could be a playfield connector or cpu/ribbon cable. There are 5 connectors going from the PDB to the playfield so that is unlikely the issue. So we're still back at a CPU, the PDB logic or a connection issue between the CPU and the PDB.

I think you already reseated the ribbon cables. You could reverse them and see what happens, or using an ohmmeter check continuity on each wire.

#21 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

Thanks!

So, the only cable I can reverse is the one that connects CPU and PDB isn't it?
I cannot test such cable, the hole are too small...

May be I can test each cable coming out from the PDB and CPU board to see if signals can arrive to the playfield?

#22 8 years ago

TAB

terryb

Inactive member

OP
Quoted from Faz:
So, the only cable I can reverse is the one that connects CPU and PDB isn't it?
I cannot test such cable, the hole are too small...

Yes, the ribbon cable.

To test it use a paper clip to get into the hole.

#23 8 years ago

MAC

wantdataeast

Inactive member

Quoted from terryb:
Yes, the ribbon cable.
To test it use a paper clip to get into the hole.

That is not the best. You can bend connectors in permanent open position if you are not careful. Your multimeter should have leads that are point enough to test on the side of the connector. .... I am assuming we are talking about checking continuity here?

#24 8 years ago

TAB

terryb

Inactive member

Quoted from wantdataeast:
That is not the best. You can bend connectors in permanent open position if you are not careful. Your multimeter should have leads that are point enough to test on the side of the connector.

You do know we're talking about ribbon cables?

The only thing on the side is the end of the wire and testing there would require a fine probe tip adapter, which most people aren't going to have, and that technique is not recommended anyways.

The correct way to test a ribbon cable is with two spare male connectors, but I presumed the OP didn't have any of those laying around.

#25 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

I have not tested it yet but.... I don't think it could be the problem... it was there.. nobody has toched it...so I don't think it could break while it has worked all the time before the problem. It does not have any mechanincal stress..

#26 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

Little update:

- I have tried to test the ribbon cable that goes from CPU Board to PowerBoard, unfortunately my paper clip was too big and I was not able to test anything.

- I have remove the ribbon and replaced it by reverting it, result was that the cpu board was not booting anymore.

I have removed again and replace it with the red pin to the top and now it boots again.

While I was doing this I have noticed what seems a burst resistor W16: it is fully missing, I can see only one pin of it and I cannot find it inside the flipper itself. I suppose it should be there but it is not there.
On the manual it is indicated as resistor of zero ohm.

Could this be the problem or part of the problem?

I have removed batteries also and checked their voltages, all seems good but now every time I power on the flippers it says "factory reset". Seems like it does not save settings and clock.

One more thing I am thinking of is the U6 chip, it should be the game ROM EPROM where the game firmware is stored.
I remember that about 12 years ago I have upgraded it with the last firmware available, and there is no label over the clear quartz window on the chip... could it have lost memory?

I am going to think that the best I can do is call someone able to fix it...

Do you know how much could it be the price for a check and repair of this kind of pinballs?

thanks!

IMG_5410.jpg

#27 8 years ago

TAB

terryb

Inactive member

OP
Quoted from Faz:
While I was doing this I have noticed what seems a burst resistor W16: it is fully missing, I can see only one pin of it and I cannot find it inside the flipper itself. I suppose it should be there but it is not there.
On the manual it is indicated as resistor of zero ohm.

Those are zero ohm jumpers and are used for system settings like language. So that's not your problem.

OP
Quoted from Faz:
I have removed batteries also and checked their voltages, all seems good but now every time I power on the flippers it says "factory reset".

Make sure the batteries are properly oriented and they are tight against the connectors and no corrosion. You could also try new batteries if you haven't.

OP
Quoted from Faz:
I remember that about 12 years ago I have upgraded it with the last firmware available, and there is no label over the clear quartz window on the chip... could it have lost memory?

That is a possibility, but doesn't necessarily match up with your problem. Although if part of the eprom got erased anything can happen.

OP
Quoted from Faz:
Do you know how much could it be the price for a check and repair of this kind of pinballs?

Sorry, I have no idea in your area. Maybe someone else can chime in.

#28 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

thanks,

today battery problem has gone, while the only thing that seems to work is the display and the menu for check and settings..

#29 8 years ago

FXS

sulli10

Pinside member

Morristown, NJ

13y 129K 2,573 33 61

Hi Faz,

I just went thru similar problems on my Congo. Your steps sound a lot like what I had done as well. I finally swapped out the CPU card with another I had, and the problems went away. Congo plays fine .

I then placed the CPU card I had pulled from Congo into another machine and the problems showed up in that machine so the problem is somewhere in the card.

I do not know if you have access to other cards for TAF but that may be a next step. Good Hunting.

#30 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member

Thank you,

unfortunately I don't have any other cpu board to make switch.

Today I have asked a friend to program a new Eprom with the last firmware H-4, I will try to change such chip to see if my Eprom is defective.

If even this will fail, I will try to remove cpu board and power board to look back and check for any possible sign of burning or cold welding.

...then I will phone someone able to fix it!

#31 8 years ago

Faz

Inactive member