The point is, the code on newer Stern code is deeper than most previous games. I have owned ACDC for about 2 years now and I still can't explain all the rules. This depth of code takes longer to complete. Stern also produces many titles each year. No other company can also make that claim presently. Unfortunately, it also means that they're probably always struggling to keep up. One option would be to make shallow rule sets. Thank God that's not what is happening.

Unless you're brand new to pinball, you have already heard about how long some games take before they're great.
I just bought a Walking Dead three weeks ago. It's fantastic! It's quite different from the game I played when it was originally released. So if you can't enjoy the ride, wait until a game is coded to your liking before buying it. Otherwise, the joke's on you. Nobody else suffers. Not Stern, not the rest of Pinside... Just you.

Odin and Plungemaster, you guys do nothing but whine about Stern code.
Go play your non-Stern titles, and leave the Stern pins to those of us who understand that life isn't simple, making pinballs isn't easy, but remain happy with the games that are being released and the enjoyment that they bring.

See, I think it's a brilliant model. LEs for those must-have fans, or folks who can afford the space and cash for an unproven pin.
Premiums for the rest of us.
So long as my Premium has all of the play features that an LE has, it's a great system.
That's not even discussing that the LEs are sometimes flawed. Stern needs more time to find issues and fix them.
The Premium model is also safer in that regard.
The real problem is, too many cant-wait-yahoos, who can't keep it in their pants, rush out and buy a game without thinking about it for any length of time.
I've been that Yahoo, and might be again in the future -but the bottom line is, if you're buying a game without finished code and it's not good enough for you, you're the one that needs to change.
Sterns model works if you purchase wisely.

I would be willing to bet that Stern knows more about their clients than you do, given your collection, history, and wish list.

As pinball enthusiasts, I'm sure we'd all love to have Stern hire a dozen more programmers, have them code as well as Lyman, and for Stern to release more than one code for each title.
(Imagine that: you play Lyman's TWD code, then download a whole different set of rules and play that for a while, just for a change of pace)
The thing is, Stern has always said that their focus is on the factory line and keeping people working.
They're not "lazy" as some have said. I doubt very much that the coders are goofing off instead of working.
This is an art form, it's not manual labour. I doubt even Lyman knows how many hours it would take to make a game great.
Buyers can wait until code is proven before putting their money down. If that's what you feel is best, there's no drawback to doing that. So far as I've seen, Premiums have typically been available after code is polished and proven.
Yes, we'd all prefer that games were produced with full code but that's just not happening.

What will be interesting to see is if these other new companies can produce fewer titles with full code, and keep people working.

I'm guessing more like 5% of potential buyers and 90% of non-buyers.
It's fine if someone doesn't like the pins that Stern produces, but to rant about lack of code just shows ignorance.
There are some great pins available to buy. In my, and my friends opinions the best ever made.
ACDC, Mettalica, Walking Dead -top three games ever made.
Each one began as ho-hum or worse until the code made it what it is currently.

Stern really doesn't have a long way to go. They are currently the only game in town. Some may reply: "Wait til Spooky/Heighway/JJP starts pumping out multiple titles!", but as of now, no other company has proven that they are capable of producing multiple titles each year. When even ONE competitor can produce more than a single machine each year, we'll see if they can keep the production lines moving, AND produce deep code, selling enough pins to survive.
Until that day, Stern is king. They are the ones with an operating assembly line.
Too many Pinsiders are completely ignorant. They make statements about Stern "not caring", or making poor business decisions. They just look like fools. "I know better" than a company who has survived the dark years of pinball, possibly the only reason pinball is still alive. "I think they should do things differently! -confusing "What Stern should do", with what they WISH Stern would do.
Do us all a favour: take a hike, and don't let the coin door hit your ass on the way out. (Not directed at you, Baiter)
If Stern wasn't doing things right, TWD Premiums would be available right now, gathering dust in distributors warehouses. We wouldn't all be complaining about the extra few weeks/months, waiting for the GoT LEs and Premiums. If Stern wasn't doing things right, we'd all know what titles are being made next, and we wouldn't care. Instead, there's excitement about pinball. The market is growing. People are playing. They're having fun. And that's thanks in a very large part to Stern and the new games they're making, whether you like it or not.

Disagree. Premiums are always still available after the code is done.
At least is was for all the pins I can think of.
No?

you guys are the absolute worst part of pinball in my opinion.
We have (or maybe more like "had") an opportunity to get info/feedback from the only real pinball company in existence.
No disrespect meant to JJP, Spooky, or Heighway -but currently Stern is by far the only producer of multiple titles each year.
We may not agree or appreciate how they do things all the time, but having Jared here at least opened the door to discussion, feedback, and most importantly: future opportunities for improved communication.
Jared did a great job in my opinion of explaining Sterns stance on things like the importance of deep code at time of release. Pinsiders hate not having complete code from the get-go. Stern feels that's it's more important to keep the factory lines working, and that in time, code is improved. It was suggested that if code is most important to you, as a buyer, then you can sit back and wait for games to be finished.
Pinsiders who didn't like that answer whined about being offended, being unappreciated.

So Stern can't win because a bunch of middle-aged internet tough-guys would rather buy up new releases and then complain about them, than to actually make rational purchases, like vault editions, or games that have had time to have completed code.

I know this post won't win me any popularity with any of you and I dont care. The truth is, you've helped reduce this website to useless posts with hateful commentary -with the exception being some extremely helpful repair threads thrown in.

Nice work fellas, you finally won.

DNO has it right.
Stern doesn't announce work-in-progress, nor do they promise deadlines or ETAs.
And still, idiots start complaining about how Stern NEEDS to do things differently.
Stern hired Jared to communicate with us, and too many assholes jumped on the hate wagon.
No more communication from Stern.
Stern hasn't even announced Ghostbusters yet, and already the Pinsider lynch-mob is bitching about various aspects that they don't like.
To me, that proves that Stern isn't seeking our approval, they don't care about your suggestions on running their business, or how they handle code releases.
Stern puts out the only titles I consider worthy of the current prices.
I agree with you Flash, in that I want to see proven code before I put cash down -but that doesn't give me reason to bitch about Stern.
Right now, Stern has a few different fully-coded pins available for sale. If you like the Game of Thrones theme, or Ghostbusters, you only have to wait a little longer.
Criticizing Stern for not releasing fully coded titles doesn't show that they're doing things wrong, it simply shows that you don't understand their business model.

What's absolutely awesome is how well they're doing right now. I placed an order for two pins back in November (?), and am still waiting for one of them. Yes, they were short of parts but also clearly have orders keeping them busy.

I guess there are enough happy customers out there with things just the way they are now.

I still don't get the complaints. On a website where the Ghostbusters thread is over 4000(?) posts long, before the game was even announced, I think it can be said that Pinsiders can't wait to get their hands on anything new.
So now we have a few people complaining that Stern is wronging us, the customer, by producing games with incomplete code, and that Stern should hold off on releasing a title until it's 100% done?

Half full, or half empty?

If you view it as half empty, you just need to be patient until the game is proven, and the code is complete, or near-enough, that you like the game. Walking Dead is a perfect example: I thought it was dull when it was released. Now that Lyman has blown the doors off of it rules-wise, I decided it was time to buy one.

Don't be bitter just because other people sign up to be guinea pigs. If that's not your style, that's fine. But it might be preferred for others.

"slow the frequency of announcements..." -you mean, delay new games being produced?
Cause if that's what you're saying, you weren't paying attention in class my friend.

The end result is this:

this is how Stern operates. Like it or not. No, nobody on here actually knows a better way to make this work, with fully coded games being released while keeping the production line running. You're all just wagging your chins.

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH THE REAL FLASHINSTINCT!?!

The bottom line is this:
You get what you pay for. Meaning: whatever code is done when you buy it is the code you own.
Anything further is a bonus. If you don't like what's on your machine, you're an idiot for buying it as is.
Complaining about the fact that you bought an incomplete game is like whining because you ate an ice cream too fast and now it's all gone.
Damn, it's not like you're forced to buy blind. Go play the game. Watch videos. Read reviews.
Be a grown up.