(Topic ID: 57789)

AAB v Replay EM's Opinions

By Shapeshifter

6 years ago

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  • 193 posts
  • 52 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by boilerman
  • Topic is favorited by 4 Pinsiders


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    #77 5 years ago
    Quoted from Chet:

    I have my single player Gulfstream set to AAB. It is easily switched to Replay also. Nice option on this game that is a true AAB game. When I played arcades when I was young, I always liked replay games better than AAB for some reason.

    It is these era Single Player williams games that I like because they are also "Both" AAB and Replay at the same time. "Special" features on the playfield will award an extra ball (in Balls to Play format up to 9 or 10) and Score Thresholds as well as very special playfield features like the 4 corners on Gulfstream or the 3 Wagons on Klondike can award multiple replays. So, you get the best of both worlds. What makes it better for me, is that unlike the pure AAB games, they don't go on forever since it typically takes a number of balls to complete the playfield specials. So ultimately, you get to slightly extend your game but also get to rack up Replays to try again.

    #92 5 years ago
    Quoted from StevenP:

    Simply stated, in freeplay home use, AAB gives you a chance to extend your game, whereas replay merely lets you win meaningless credits or light meaningless specials to give you credits that don't affect your score.

    I guess we (you and me) look at it differently. To me, the "Meaningless" credits or specials DO mean something to me just like your high scores mean something to you. In fact, all time High Scores are "meaningless" to ME. Plenty of us "replay" people play our games paying attention to how many credits we "racked up" during a single game. Just like you pay attention to chasing a super high score. Some of us even put our games on Coin Play so we can gauge the value or return for the purchased credit and awarded replays even though they are still technically free. But for us, we perhaps like the idea of a finite limit to how long a game should last or go on. I have said it several times, I consider most AAB games (the ones specifically designed to be AAB only) to be perpetual Hell! Just like many of Today's DMD collectors complain about many Stern games lasting 20 minutes or more to complete a game of 3 balls. EMs were never designed around having marathon games. Early games were designed to be gambling devices. Later, when they were specifically engineered for Amusement and replays, they were designed around a target average game time of 2 1/2 to 3 minutes and a replay award of around 30% (although I have read it stated to be as high as 50%). And as you stated, AAB games were designed for a specific territory to get around very strict coin op laws. They were not the "norm" for any of the manufacturers. If these laws did not exist, neither would the AAB game.

    Mr./Mrs. AAB sees two goals in front of him/her on your AAB game: A sequence feature to be completed to light the WOW/Special, and an End of Game High Score. And you get the added benefit of getting additional extra balls as you reach the score thresholds (ie 60K, 120K, 170K) and as you are awarded WOWs on the playfield. Which in all practicality, could allow you to extend your game indefinitely.

    Mr./Mrs. Replay sees two goals in front of him/her: A sequence feature to complete to light specials and Score Thresholds to beat to award a Replay. And, if it so matters to him/her (which it really doesn't to me) logging an all time high score.

    First off, let me state that no one likes a game that is either too easy or impossible to win/beat. So playing a poorly shopped game is as disappointing as playing a game that ends up being way too easy to continually beat. So yes, games can be set up hard, or easy. And are typically tailored to the owner's ability.

    Although it varies from game to game, there are typically two types of AAB ruleset. From how I understand it, most allow you to light the WOW. Once lit, you are allowed to shoot for it. Once you get it, it will only remain lit as long as the ball remains on the playfield. Other games award a WOW upon ball drain and then reset the sequence. Some games award a single WOW and then reset the sequence while the ball is still on the playfield.

    For the most part, the Replay counterparts allow you to light the Special which then remains lit until the end of your game (3/5 balls). So, we are limited in the time frame (balls per play) of completing the sequence, and limited on the number of replays we can be awarded (credit wheel limit 5, 10, 15 etc.)

    And your comment about it being all about Nostalgic memories or personal sentiment is somewhat funny to me since most "collectors" are doing so for just that reason. If you want to discuss it in the context of operating EM games or even early solid state games, my argument for replay would be even stronger.

    #97 5 years ago
    Quoted from StevenP:

    I guess you can't count credits on the reel though, but how many credits can you win from a single replay game anyway? Generally just one, sometimes two

    Sorry, I didn't mean to clasify you as an AAB person or start an Us Vs. Them fight. I was only trying to convey that there is a significance to a Replay to many of us. And to expand on what Dirtflipper has pointed out, yes, you can get more than 1 or 2 replays on a single game. That is the rush I am trying to convey. Most Gott. single player games have that "almost got it. Just one more play" aspect. You are only 1 or 2 lights or Drop Targets away from completing the sequence to light specials and your game ends. It makes you want to start anew and try again. Next time, you might light the special on 2nd ball but still fail to score even one Replay. They were very well balanced in that way. Then you have that game where all the stars seem to align and you get the special lit on 3rd ball, rack up a few, and still have 2 more balls to shoot for more. Three of the best examples of this for me are El Dorado, 4 Square, and 2001. You can have games where you get no where, and you can have games where you max out the replay reel.

    And for us, every "knock" has its meaning. While some might like it, the multiple knocks (5 etc.) per Extra Ball earned on some AABs is over kill if not down-right annoying.

    Quoted from DirtFlipper:

    (with the exception of the few games from '75-'76 that used the 'half-moon' credit unit, which only goes to 9).

    Actually, Dirt, it can go to 19. At 10, it still displays a 0 but the light that illuminates the Half Moon remains lit (as it does for 11-19). It just by then, most games were probably limted at 5 or 9 replays.

    #110 5 years ago
    Quoted from Boatcat:

    IMO, It's because rather than having a AAB design team, Gtb. (for obvious reasons), chose the economy route, convert the replay design.

    But neither Bally or Williams had any measureable quantity of AAB only games. They selected to incorporate the feature into the regular run of games and leave it up to the operator to decide. And they too re-used the same basic layout and rules to convert to AAB and Novelty machines. In fact, from what I can remember, they made no attempt whatsoever (other than artwork) to make changes for AAB. Gottlieb, on the other hand, did make changes to improve the AAB experience for those territories.

    Obviously, in certain markets (such as Italy) it was mandated to be AAB only and the reason for yet a second version of AAB games for Gottlieb. In these cases, the games usually featured the ability to tally a higher score than their domestic counterparts. Gottlieb, utilized what would have been the match unit (useless on an AAB game) and expanded the scoring with 10 more backglass lights. Not exactly sure why they decided not to just add an extra score reel?

    As far as "increased collectability" and "higher pricing" go for AAB, it is probably true of acquiring an Italian version of the Gottlieb AAB in America. I would love to find a decent priced Texas Ranger. That would be one AAB I would be proud and happy to own.


    #112 5 years ago

    You are absolutely right. It officially began with Gottlieb's "Flipper" but was predated by a prototype of Dancing Dolls.


    2 years later
    #162 2 years ago
    Quoted from Electrocute:

    Machines like Wizard! with the extra ball feature function as add a ball and replay. Best of both combined!

    Not exactly: "Maximum 1 Extra Ball per Ball in Play"

    #164 2 years ago
    Quoted from AlexF:

    A game like Klondike game be set up to be a little of both. With different reel combinations awarding added balls or replays.

    Which is why I love that era Single Player Williams series. Like Gulf Stream. Specials on the playfield award add a balls. While scores, match and 4 corners can award replays.

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