A Joust Restore [Insert catchy title here]

(Topic ID: 221701)

A Joust Restore [Insert catchy title here]


By djblouw

7 months ago



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  • 128 posts
  • 27 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 27 days ago by djblouw
  • Topic is favorited by 31 Pinsiders

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There are 128 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
20
#1 7 months ago

Out of pure luck I managed to find a Williams Joust. It was quite the event to come to terms on purchase, and even more work to get it out of its storage spot. It will need lots of work, but I'm excited to restore it to it's glory.

Here's the pic of it unloaded in my driveway after getting it home:

Joust wrapped (resized).JPG

#2 7 months ago

After unwrapping it, you can tell that it's been in storage for a very long time. The dust that you see is what's left AFTER I cleaned it off at the warehouse to make sure the pf was still in the game. Yeah, it's going to require a lot of cleaning.

Dirty (resized).JPG

First thing was to get into it, since there were no keys included. I had to pop the lock with a screwdriver. The coin door lock will be a different story. Once I got into the cabinet I could unscrew the two side access doors with the boards. But I couldn't reach the under access doors, so I had to pop two more locks. Are there any other games that have 6 locks on them!!

Coin door (resized).JPG

#3 7 months ago

Nice grab! really want to see this one shine

#4 7 months ago

Nice find! Looking forward to seeing you restore this one, and coming to play it.

#5 7 months ago

congrats!

just waiting on my CPR pf and plastics and I will join you in the quest!

#6 7 months ago
Quoted from Houkaka:

Nice grab! really want to see this one shine

Quoted from Rock914:

Nice find! Looking forward to seeing you restore this one, and coming to play it.

Thanks guys. After my Flash Gordon & Fathom restores, I needed to get away from Bally SS games for a bit. So Joust will fit the bill.

#7 7 months ago

After getting it open, the good news was that the batteries weren't on the MPU board.

The bad news is that they had corroded so much, they fell off the board all by themselves. The MPU is toasted. Driver board is salvageable, with just minor corrosion on the interconnect pins.

So, if anyone has a spare System 7 MPU, I'd greatly appreciate it.

Toasted board (resized).JPG

#8 7 months ago
Quoted from djblouw:

After unwrapping it, you can tell that it's been in storage for a very long time. The dust that you see is what's left AFTER I cleaned it off at the warehouse to make sure the pf was still in the game. Yeah, it's going to require a lot of cleaning.

First thing was to get into it, since there were no keys included. I had to pop the lock with a screwdriver. The coin door lock will be a different story. Once I got into the cabinet I could unscrew the two side access doors with the boards. But I couldn't reach the under access doors, so I had to pop two more locks. Are there any other games that have 6 locks on them!!

congrats on the grab
however, if you reached out before having using a screwdriver, I could have told you that by drilling out just one of the locks under the cabinet on either of the flip down panels, you could have simply removed the other 5 locks from the inside and saved yourself a ton of grief

#9 7 months ago
Quoted from djblouw:

So, if anyone has a spare System 7 MPU, I'd greatly appreciate it.

if you can find anyone that has a set of the MPU and driver boards from pinballpcb.com (now defunct), that's the way to go. really nice replacement boards that eliminated that gawd awful 40-pin interconnect with a simple IDE connector

#10 7 months ago
Quoted from j_m_:

if you reached out before having using a screwdriver, I could have told you that by drilling out one of the locks under the cabinet for either of the flip down panels, you could have simply removed the other 5 locks from the inside and saved yourself a ton of grief

Yeah, I know. I was thinking of messaging you, but it was a Sunday afternoon, and I didn't want to bug you.

I could actually reach the lock mechanism from inside the cabinet, but couldn't get enough torque on it to remove the catch. But actually, those locks popped remarkably easy, and I'd have to replace them anyways, so no big loss.

#11 7 months ago

So, as the story goes, the guy that ran the arcade told me that they pulled the game because it wasn't making very much money. So this machine had been in a warehouse since 1985 or 1986.

June 1986 (resized).JPG

They must have been in a huge rush to get it out of the location, since they didn't even empty the quarters out of it. I think this game is starting to pay for itself--haha.

Cha-ching (resized).JPG

#12 7 months ago

Good luck with the restore.

I like to hear the back story on these hidden gems...they were in such a rush to get it out of the arcade in 1986, they forgot to collect the quarters...good thing they decided to put it in the warehouse and not in the dumpster, as I'm sure back then they probably saw zero value in really keeping it. I've read on pinside that back in the day Chucky Cheese put perfectly good pins in the trash rather than take up valuable warehouse space.

#13 7 months ago
Quoted from j_m_:

if you can find anyone that has a set of the MPU and driver boards from pinballpcb.com (now defunct)

I have been looking for some time and have not found one.

Any idea why they closed up shop?

#14 7 months ago
Quoted from djblouw:

Yeah, I know. I was thinking of messaging you, but it was a Sunday afternoon, and I didn't want to bug you.

this.
I hope that going forward, no feels that they are "bothering me" if they have a joust related question
heck, I think that I sent hilton (whysnow) a small novel when he mentioned that he was picking one up and needed to "break it down" to fit inside an SUV

#15 7 months ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I have been looking for some time and have not found one.
Any idea why they closed up shop?

from their webstore:
"Thank you to the pinball community for your support throughout the years. This business started as a part time hobby and grew significantly. Unfortunately, we don't have the time or manpower to continue. It was a personal decision to halt production."

it's really is a shame too. I've replaced all of my original boards years ago with pinballpcb's stuff [the mpu, driver, power, sound and display boards along with the gas plasma displays]. I bagged up all of the originals & carefully stored them away and haven't had so much as a slightest hiccup since

#16 7 months ago

So after destroying some locks, I got the glass off, and could look around.

Lucky for me, there was a mouse nest in the game. It looked like it had been in there since around 1995. So I put on the gloves and mask, got out the shop vac and cleaned it up.

After it was cleaned up I checked out the area. The mice were nice enough to chew some of the wires. So now I'll have some more work in patching the wires back together.

Nasty (resized).JPG

#17 7 months ago

yeah, that huge power inlet hole makes for a nice mouse hole

at least the boards (power and sound) on the P2 side still look nice and clean. transformer sled doesn't look too bad, however I would check that large electrolytic capacitor (I still have no idea why williams decided to paint the wood on their transformer sleds from that era white

#18 7 months ago

Cool find.. following!

#19 7 months ago
Quoted from djblouw:

They must have been in a huge rush to get it out of the location, since they didn't even empty the quarters out of it.

What's the youngest date of any of those quarters?

#20 6 months ago
Quoted from vid1900:

What's the youngest date of any of those quarters?

yeah, good chance of having some silver (1964 and back) quarters in there

#21 6 months ago
Quoted from j_m_:

yeah, that huge power inlet hole makes for a nice mouse hole
at least the boards (power and sound) on the P2 side still look nice and clean. transformer sled doesn't look too bad, however I would check that large electrolytic capacitor (I still have no idea why williams decided to paint the wood on their transformer sleds from that era white

Yeah, boards on P2 side look good. I've pulled the sled already. A lot of this stuff will get cleaned and re-painted. Think I should leave it white, or paint it black to match everything else?

Cap will most likely be replaced. I hate to just start replacing stuff, but I'll end up doing the caps on the power supply too.

#22 6 months ago

Mouse's nest removed.
Playfield removed.
Coin door removed.
Access doors removed.
Transformer removed.

Time to separate the machine into more manageable halves.

Lower Cab (resized).JPGUpper cab (resized).JPG

Now I can start stripping the metal pieces out to have them re-plated.

#23 6 months ago

if it were me and I was restoring it (period correct), I would just clean it up or repaint that board white again

question:
did yours come with the 2 pieces of 1"x1" square stock that rest in the channels above the playfield? (they prevent any "air balls" from falling into the cabinet if they roll all the way up the aprons
many of the ones that I've seen are missing these (along with the playfield support bar inside the cabinet

if you plan on replacing the playfield plastics with new ones from CPR (once they become available), be aware that williams used a really strong adhesive under those end marquees. I ended up taking a hair dryer (not a heat gun) and slowly warmed up a corner to pry that loose and then continuing to slowly work the rest of the panel off using the heat

after removing it completely, I used goo gone (not goof off!) to strip all of the remaining glue from the routed section. when I put the new plastics on, I didn't even remove the backing paper (since the panel is not backlit) to help keep anything from potentially scratching off the ink

#24 6 months ago

What was the price new of Joust back when they came out. ?

#25 6 months ago
Quoted from j_m_:

be aware that williams used a really strong adhesive under those end marquees.

Yes, I removed the carriage bolts, and discovered it was glued on. The marquees are in pretty good shape, just dirty, so I'm going to leave them in place, and just clean and polish a bit.

Quoted from j_m_:

did yours come with the 2 pieces of 1"x1" square stock that rest in the channels above the playfield?

Yes, one on each side, that have to be removed after the lock down bar is taken out. And the pf support was still in place, held in with one wing nut--the other was missing.

I couldn't figure out how the support would actually work, so I didn't even try it. I just unplugged everything and took it out.

#26 6 months ago

those marquees actually look pretty good. Mine are faded almost to white. that will be a nice project that should turn out nice.

#27 6 months ago

that sticker is super cool I'd leave it!

#28 6 months ago
Quoted from djblouw:

I couldn't figure out how the support would actually work, so I didn't even try it. I just unplugged everything and took it out.

you lift the playfield from the 1P side (there should be little stickers on the 2 metal "wings" that state [LIFT FROM THIS SIDE ONLY]. under the playfield, near the front edge, you should see a metal bracket that one end of the support bar fits into. the other end slides into a notched out section in the middle of the cabinet directly under the center carriage bolt holding the marquee in place

DO NOT lift from the P2 side wiliams has warned you, heed the advice
why? because the cabling running from the playfield to the boards isn't long enough to allow the playfield to be lifted up from the P2 side (and there is no bracket or notch to hold the playfield support from that side either

the metal bracket under the playfield

w/ the support in place

where the bottom end of the support is placed

backing up to show it all
I love how the stenciled text on my support bar reads: "support bar. do not throw away playfield", instead of "do not throw away playfield support bar."

ps
I don't even know where the wing nuts for my support bar are any more (they might be in the coin box). they were nothing but a pain in the @ss when you're holding the playfield up with one arm and attempting to spin them off to free up the support bar

#29 6 months ago
Quoted from Rock914:

Nice find! Looking forward to seeing you restore this one, and coming to play it.

I'm with Chris. Hoping that being local may give me a chance to see this beauty when you get done with it.

#30 6 months ago
Quoted from PinballJeff:

I'm with Chris. Hoping that being local may give me a chance to see this beauty when you get done with it.

My goal is to have this at PATZ for 2019, so everyone can enjoy it (unless I get offered stupid money for it before then).

But, if it's finished earlier than that I'll make sure to send out an invite to the locals to come play it.

#31 6 months ago
Quoted from j_m_:

I love how the stenciled text on my support bar reads: "support bar. do not throw away playfield", instead of "do not throw away playfield support bar."

Mine reads "do not throw away playfield" "support bar". Obviously their stencils were not all connected.

Random metal parts (resized).jpg

My support bar isn't the prettiest, and I'd love to re-plate it, but I'd have to make stencils to get the wording back on there. So I may wait on doing that for now.

Thank for the informative guide on how to use the support bar.

#32 6 months ago

some of the support bars had a white, vinyl decal wrapped about the bar. when I owned 3 joust machines, at least one was that way but I chose to keep the bare metal stenciled support bar knowing that I would never have to worry about the glue from the decal getting old

#33 6 months ago

"So how does the pf look?" you ask. Well, it's covered in dirt. I'm pretty sure it has never been cleaned or wiped down. Since it wasn't earning at the arcade, they probably didn't care what it looked like. And then it went into storage.

Overall, I think it looks pretty good.
No planking that I can see (or very little).
No wear spots that I could find. Mylar still in tact on slings & end of shooter lane
Minor wear around some of the inserts.

PF (resized).JPG

I did a quick couple passes with Novous 2, just to see how bad the dirt and ball swirls were. I'm pleasantly surprised. With a little elbow grease, it should look very presentable.

Quick wipe of the pf (resized).jpg

All the plastics look to be in tact and not broken. The drop target decals & spinner decals are worn. But those can be replaced.

#34 6 months ago

I think that you might need to replace that right outlane/kicker rubber. it looks a little loose

on a slightly more serious note, I never really understood why hunter target '2' was a bullseye stand-up but '3' was solid red on both sides

#35 6 months ago

Ok sir looking good. Maybe I need to shoot for PATZ 2019 also so we can have 2 available to play. Assuming the playfields get built before then...

#36 6 months ago
Quoted from CobraMark:

Ok sir looking good. Maybe I need to shoot for PATZ 2019 also so we can have 2 available to play. Assuming the playfields get built before then...

Now THAT would be an impressive showing. 2 Jousts. Anyone have a King Kong that they could bring?? haha

#37 6 months ago

Cool restoration man always wanted to get into one of these!

#38 6 months ago
Quoted from djblouw:

My goal is to have this at PATZ for 2019, so everyone can enjoy it (unless I get offered stupid money for it before then).
But, if it's finished earlier than that I'll make sure to send out an invite to the locals to come play it.

Sounds great to me. Let me know if I can assist in any way.

#39 6 months ago

What a find! I am sooo jealous. Nice to see it's in good hands. Now its time to find some stupid money.

1 week later
#40 6 months ago

Its been too hot & humid to do much work on the cabinet. I've sanded the interior base, and black exterior, ready for repaint.

I did find the serial number stamping, and it does match all the stickers on the boards.

Serial Number (resized).JPG

#41 6 months ago

So, while I was waiting, I started checking on the pf.

As previously noted, it's dirty. But all the plastics are in good shape. The cross over ones are intact. They need to be cleaned, but should be okay.
PF Before (resized).JPG

I got it up on the rotisserie, and stripped everything from the top side. Lamp sockets are corroded. And a couple of the threaded screws broke off in the tee nut. But, I was most likely replacing them anyway, so it should be okay.

Stripped PF (resized).JPG

1 week later
#42 6 months ago

Finally got the bottom stripped. And I thought classic Bally’s were a chore! I am not excited about putting the wire harnesses back on.

DC299255-E533-49C9-8961-82CE2462309B (resized).jpeg

#43 6 months ago

I cleaned one half. As expected, it cleaned up pretty decent.

There seems to be a light haze in the heavily traveled areas. I’ll have to get a couple coats of wax on it and see how it looks.

CC6EBBBC-F9DE-4C5E-B75B-61C0400E7735 (resized).jpeg

#44 6 months ago
Quoted from djblouw:

Finally got the bottom stripped. And I thought classic Bally’s were a chore! I am not excited about putting the wire harnesses back on.
[quoted image]

yeah, williams managed to pack just about every square inch underneath that playfield. fortunately, the topside tears down pretty quickly (it took me about 30-40 mins to completely tear down 1/2 of the playfield in preparation for the CPR repro playfield, although I'm not relishing going through the bottom side

(I remember how much of a pain it was just to get to some of the screws for the drop mechanisms to remove & replace the stickers on the drop down targets

thanks for the photos (I'm not looking forward to re-doing the ground braid, but fortunately there doesn't appear to as much as I feared

#45 6 months ago
Quoted from j_m_:

yeah, williams managed to pack just about every square inch underneath that playfield. fortunately, the topside tears down pretty quickly (it took me about 30-40 mins to completely tear down 1/2 of the playfield in preparation for the CPR repro playfield, although I'm not relishing going through the bottom side
(I remember how much of a pain it was just to get to some of the screws for the drop mechanisms to remove & replace the stickers on the drop down targets
thanks for the photos (I'm not looking forward to re-doing the ground braid, but fortunately there doesn't appear to as much as I feared

Yes, topside was quick. Underside, not so much. It's odd that Williams used the ground wire for some of the drop mech coils but power wire is in the coil (hv) harness.

The ground braid is pretty simple, when compared to classic Bally games. That's the least of my worries.

The largest issue I have is that at least one screw in each switch stack has broken off (from rust) when trying to remove. So I have to either reposition each switch, or find a way to get the broken screw out. Ugh....

#46 6 months ago
Quoted from djblouw:

"So how does the pf look?" you ask. Well, it's covered in dirt. I'm pretty sure it has never been cleaned or wiped down. Since it wasn't earning at the arcade, they probably didn't care what it looked like. And then it went into storage.
Overall, I think it looks pretty good.
No planking that I can see (or very little).
No wear spots that I could find. Mylar still in tact on slings & end of shooter lane
Minor wear around some of the inserts.
[quoted image]
I did a quick couple passes with Novous 2, just to see how bad the dirt and ball swirls were. I'm pleasantly surprised. With a little elbow grease, it should look very presentable.
[quoted image]
All the plastics look to be in tact and not broken. The drop target decals & spinner decals are worn. But those can be replaced.

I hope you got this one cheap. looks like a sweet score. I've restored a few Joust playfields over the years, and this one looks better than most i've done. Good find.

#47 6 months ago

also, nice score on finding that Williams Ringer.

#48 6 months ago
Quoted from CaptainNeo:

I hope you got this one cheap. looks like a sweet score. I've restored a few Joust playfields over the years, and this one looks better than most i've done. Good find.

Meh, probably not a good deal in many people's book. If/when I sell it, I'll probably break even. But I do it as a hobby, so that's okay.

Quoted from CaptainNeo:

also, nice score on finding that Williams Ringer.

Hehe. Yeah, that just kinda watches over as I restore games. I actually haven't been able to get it working yet. So if anyone wants to loan some time to help me fix it, I'll put you at the top of the list for playing Joust once it's put back together!

#49 6 months ago

just clean all the contacts good. Make sure everything is making and breaking well. Should boot right up and play good.

#50 6 months ago

Looks awesome. Joust is on my list but its going to have to be a restore candidate like you found. Your making excellent progress. Be sure to stop and enjoy one and a while!

As for the screws that broke and are now stuck. I have an extraction kit and you may find this to be a fairly good solution depending on how far down they broke. What I have is designed mostly for removing stripped screws where you have a bit of the head left. Clearly this is not the case for you but the principal should none the less apply.

My kit consists of the following two pieces you use in series. Step 1 is the take a drill bit with a very shallow taper and cut a cone into the top of the stripped metal. Step 2 is you basically take what amounts to a reverse threaded die and start screwing it into the depression using a power drill in reverse- when the die hits bottom the threads grab and bite the metal and you back the whole thing out.

The issue is going to be two fold- can you actually get anything to hold center on the broken shaft and cut a shallow depression. If you can figure that out your golden and just need to find a small die that matches.

Anyhow- not saying I have done this for a broken screw and it could be extremely difficult given diameter of screw and the fact that you may not be able to hold center. However- you could use an oversize bit (like 1/2 inch) and take the top 1/8 inch of wood off from the screw hole on the underside- that would hold center over the broken shaft and generate a nice cone to grab with the die- if the screw shaft is up that high if the break is down the hole you may be up a creek as you could not do this without damaging the Playfield.

Then its just a matter of filling the small neat 1/2 inch hole and sanding and repainting the underside. I suspect your going to be filling a few damaged spots and painting this anyway so it may be worth a try.

Granted drilling a 1/2 inch bit into the bottom sounds sketchy but with the right bit I really think this could work and its not going to effect anything at all- filling is trivial and you can fill with a compound that will hold the new screw even better than wood if you wanted to so no loss in integrity if this works.

Advice- break a few screws off in a 2x4 and test this method before you try it.

Else maybe someone else stops by with a wiz bang trick and we both learn something new.

Good luck and I hope this makes sense.

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