Its a risk you take going to an expo any expo especially if there's other cheaper parts near common sense would say that you aren't guaranteed too make any money off expo but just get word out maybe make some money back. I don't think anyone banks off of expo. Personally its cool and all to see parts for sale but its almost all stuff we can fins online besides used parts, but most of us come for the games and to be with the community.
Quoted from trilogybeer:Hey Centerflank , what are you doing on this day? I've heard they have beer .
Im rolling down with Jay, should I pick you up on the way down?
Quoted from mikepin:Its not really up to TERRY to deal with EXpo vendors.. There are more that were not happy about shuttle as well. It makes no sense to allow shuttle anymore JUST siphones spendable money from vendors .
Explain how Pinball Life vending at Expo WOULDN'T siphon spendable money for the other vendors.
Remember, you have never wanted Pinball Life to have a shuttle and you have never wanted Pinball Life to have an open house, but you have ALWAYS wanted me to be a vendor at your show. This would take more money out of other vendors pockets than my off-site open house does.
The real issue here is that when Pinball Life does not vend at Expo Mike Pacak doesn't make any money, and THAT'S the bottom line.
Again no vendors selling the same sort of products we do would want Pinball Life inside of Expo with a big booth of parts competing for their dollars right next to them for 4 days. If these vendors have to pick (and they have to pick) between Pinball Life being at Expo and Pinball Life doing a 6 hour open house 40 miles away from Expo they all pick the latter. Bring me the names of any-and-all vendors who would prefer the former. There simply are none. The pinball business is full of some pretty smart business people; none of them are this stupid.
Terry.
Quoted from ilovegames007:I understand both sides of this, but this conversation should not be on this forum. I understand Mike's stance. Why would vendors like bay area, and marco support a shuttle???
Because the other option is to have Pinball Life right inside the Expo building for the whole event. Remember, Mike Pacak has always put huge pressure on me to vend at his show. How does this protect his current vendors?
Quoted from ilovegames007:Terry u used to have a small booth there...why not now??
Because Mike has banned the shuttle to my open house.
Quoted from ilovegames007:...why doesnt Pinball Life support somekind of sponsorship for expo, or giveaway some prizes for the silent auction. Mike puts up some of pinball life banners at expo, and runs the shuttle. This way the some vendors have nothing to say about this, cuz terry has a sponsership.
No vendors are saying anything, only Mike is talking. Mike run the shuttle? As in pay for it? Now THAT I'd like to see (and never will). As for *giving* anything to Mike Pacak; I'll start *giving* as soon as I see him *giving* to anyone without having a motive that doesn't ultimately fill his wallet. Not going to happen. There is a long history between the locals who bring games and how Mike treats them. It ranges from indifferent to ugly.
Quoted from ilovegames007:To make the arguement that other vendors would not be pissed is crazy!!! I would be pissed if money was walking out the door to a bus waiting outside.
You're not seeing the full picture..... Mike wants Pinball Life inside the Expo building all weekend competing directly with the other vendors. This is much worse for them than our 6 hour, off-site open house (which takes place while the vendor area is closed).
Finally, our open house is a party first and everything else second. No purchase of any kind is required and the food, drink, and pinball are all free. Are parts available for sale? Sure. Is there one ounce of pressure to purchase any of them? No. There are 364 other days in the year to worry about *the money*. On this one day we do not. It's our way of meeting and saying thanks to our customers and friends.
Terry.
P.S. - Sorry if this is all hacked up. Its my first attempt and chopping up a response.
I am saying its a unlevel playfield with TERRY having no cost at all being local and benefiting from expo people/money True other vendors might not like if TErry was there BUT allowing a shuttle to take their customers is just an insult to them. THey guy with the point about Macdonalds DO you think the hotel would allow MAcdonalds or any food place to pick up there NOT .. people have tried to have food trailers there NOT.... TErry is NOT as well liked by other vendors as he thinks... WE all know there is alot of DRAMA in all pinball.. true I have never thought the shuttle was fair to others. as far as having a open hous or customer appreciation I have NEVER ever said it was a problem ..
Quoted from frolic:This can be solved by pinball life moving their open house to another weekend. If not, then there should be some acknowledement that the open house is benefitting from the work expo does attracting people to Chicago for the weekend. Each of those visitors has finite cash, whatever the hours are.
Come on out and have a blast at my open house and don't buy a single thing. When you leave I will thank you for coming by.
Of course Expo brings in a bunch of people from out of town that would not normally be there. I see our open house as another reason to come to Expo for the weekend, not any sort of competition at all. Anyone who disagrees is certainly under no pressure to stop by our place.
First there was Disney World, then 100's of amusement attractions were built in the same area. What is Disney World's take on it? They love it. It only creates more reasons to go to the area and you can bet Disney World is the biggest winner.
Terry.
Quoted from ilovegames007:No, but if i need some parts, lets say 400$ in parts. My choices are marco, bay, or pbl, im buying from terry. he is cheaper, and ill have a bus take me there, and drop me off. Marco, and Bay are standing there with paid space, but since i can jump on a bus right outside my hotel door, not pay for gas, or drive, im going to pbl.
Doesnt matter wait time of day it is, ill wait for there cheaper parts. Now with no shuttle, ill have to drive, spend gas, worry about drinking and driving, i might think twice of paying a little extra money on parts from the vendors at the show now.
In the big picture, i still buy all my parts from terry anyways....lol
I appreciate your business. I'd love to have you stop by our open house so that I can say thank you in person.
Marco and BAA bring almost no pinball parts to Expo, BTW.
Terry.
Quoted from onceler:I was the guy you didn't know at Jay's making sure there was someone at the bottom. I was also the one asking you about a Bugs Bunny a few months ago at PBL.
I try to forget all conversations about Bugs Bunny 
Terry.
Quoted from mikepin:Yes expo does make some money not what you may think. we put ALOT of hours into it. OK HOW much does TERRY sell that day?? cash ONLY?? His genersity is very great .BUt bottom line HE SELLS ALOT OF STUFF that day..Gee do expo vendors LOOSE LED sales?? Pure and simple He takes EXPO customers from VENDORS...
And if I vended at your show I would take even more money from your vendors. Exactly who are the vendors that would rather I bring all my stuff down to Expo and set up next to them?
Terry.
Sorry for all the posts....... it's been a long day at work and I am just catching up.
The long and short of it is that this all started out 9 years ago with me (and my wife) wanting to have a party to show our appreciation to our customers and to meet new pinball people. To have our open house during Expo when the both the vendor hall and free play area were closed made sense to us. We had no idea that it would grow into the thing that it is today. We also never had any idea Mike Pacak would fight us so hard about it year after year but its something we just got used to.
The open house is supposed to be about friends, pinball, food, beverages, and most of all FUN. This pointless conflict just isn't fun. Mike and I are simply destine to never see eye-to-eye (I can't make heads or tails out of most of his e-mails and posts anyway).
I'm retiring from this thread as I really do not know what else can be said on the subject. If anyone would like to talk to me about it further please feel free to call me - 847-515-3415.
As our open house draws closer I will post to a new thread as a reminder of the event and to update the list of games that will be available to play. You can also keep up with the latest updates by visiting our web site.
I hope to see many of you at our open house. It is always nice to see old friends and put faces to the names of the new friends we have made over the past year. Despite all the drama (if that's what this has been), it will be a blast.
Terry.
Quoted from mikepin:I am saying its a unlevel playfield with TERRY having no cost at all being local and benefiting from expo people/money True other vendors might not like if TErry was there BUT allowing a shuttle to take their customers is just an insult to them. THey guy with the point about Macdonalds DO you think the hotel would allow MAcdonalds or any food place to pick up there NOT .. people have tried to have food trailers there NOT.... TErry is NOT as well liked by other vendors as he thinks... WE all know there is alot of DRAMA in all pinball.. true I have never thought the shuttle was fair to others. as far as having a open hous or customer appreciation I have NEVER ever said it was a problem ..
The more you flap your yap, the more I just want to spend all day at Terry's and not give you any money.
Quoted from Rarehero:The more you flap your yap, the more I just want to spend all day at Terry's and not give you any money.
You're not the only one Greg. I'm getting a lot of feedback from friends that are considering not going to Expo because of this, making a trip just to Terry's for the day instead. Mike let it go. You've said your piece and I think everyone understands your position. Terry couldn't be handling things better IMHO. From day one nine years ago, he's gone out of his way to make sure to set things up with as little impact as possible to Expo, ensuring that his open house is only going on when Expo is basically closed. Setting up a shuttle to make things easier on everyone, etc. You both do great things for the hobby, and I'd really hate to see things keep escalating as they sometimes do.
The T-shirt may not have been the best of ideas, but it clearly was a joke, to the point that the creator did the exact same thing on another T-shirt with the PBL logo. All in good fun. Hell, team up with Terry, have both made and sell them both at PBL and your booth at Expo. Win-win and I'm sure they'd sell well.
So again, Mike please move on, I don't think things get better by continuing to press things in a negative way. Make something positive out of it.
--
Rob Anthony
Pinball Classics
http://LockWhenLit.com
Quality Board Work - In Home Service
borygard at gmail dot com
There's a reason you keep this kind of stuff to private channels instead of airing out in a public forum. I'm with Rarehero, every further post Mike makes just makes me turned off from something that we should be celebrating. I'm just sorry that even though I'll be in town I'll be in an all day meeting Friday and will miss the open house.
Quoted from Borygard:You're not the only one Greg. I'm getting a lot of feedback from friends that are considering not going to Expo because of this, making a trip just to Terry's for the day instead.
Look, despite Mike's irrational crybaby manchild antics - I'm gonna go - I'm coming into town, so it would be stupid not to. I'm going to do exactly as I planned. Give money to Mike (Expo), give money to vendors like you, and visit Terry & give him some money....hey, maybe I'll go give Gene Cunningham some money too! 
Quoted from Rarehero:Look, despite Mike's irrational crybaby manchild antics - I'm gonna go - I'm coming into town, so it would be stupid not to. I'm going to do exactly as I planned. Give money to Mike (Expo), give money to vendors like you, and visit Terry & give him some money....hey, maybe I'll go give Gene Cunningham some money too!
Can I have some money on your way into town haha.
Quoted from jjsrt8:Can I have some money on your way into town haha.
Sure, whatcha sellin'!?
Quoted from Rarehero:Sure, whatcha sellin'!?
I was excepting donations for my first pin haha but hey I have something but I have a huge line.
http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/miniature-18th-scale-pinball-models-full-3d KISS and MM next sorry for off topic
On topic I will be attending both events and money will be spent on vendors at expo also even though I already live close to pinball life. There's things that even Terry mite not have at expo that I want so there you go no ones losingout on anything. I want that TZ blanket if its still there this year its mine.
Terry, I shop at PBL and if I was at Expo I'd go to the open house. You are certainly free to open your doors that weekend and invite everyone over.
All I'm saying as I understand the other side, and the bad optics of sending a shuttle over, without having any skin in the game or compensation. Mike drew a line in the sand with the bus, you've obliged, so I think that settles it.
I DO think that the PBL open house does ADD to the expo weekend, no question, and it could be even better if it were an "official" part of expo. So the compromise I suggest is you pay expo some cash, and Mike my suggestion to you is compromise on your side is to let the open house operate as a sponsored vendor, but they're not going to be in the vendor hall, but they at least kicked in something and their shuttles are allowed back.
All the best to everyone.
Mike,
What money is PBL taking if the vendor hall is closed during his open house hours? I don't buy it....and neither does PBL. Nor do most of the Expo attendees.
You need to quit with the Dollar Bill Wirtz way of thinking.
Quoted from mikepin:THey guy with the point about Macdonalds DO you think the hotel would allow MAcdonalds or any food place to pick up there NOT .. people have tried to have food trailers there NOT....
My name is not "guy". Feel free to call me Wolf, Marsh, or John, but I do have a name.
This goes on every day, it's called business. The company I work for has a huge national conference every year for non-profits. For several years, competitors would rent big busses and set up displays in the parking lot of the convention center we were at. It's all part of the game.
We eventually bought them all.
When I call the front desk of a hotel and ask them for a good hamburger joint, their first answer is not "the hotel restaurant".
Trying to artificially boost sales by denying consumers other options usually gets you the exact opposite of what you are trying to achieve. There's a lot of examples of this in business history.
The party is the main reason and I can buy parts any day of the week if I want to online. The specials are nice but since I fly to the expo I can't lug back a ton of stuff. The food and beverages are all free, which if you been there and see how many people go is not cheap.
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:My name is not "guy". Feel free to call me Wolf, Marsh, or John, but I do have a name.
This goes on every day, it's called business. The company I work for has a huge national conference every year for non-profits. For several years, competitors would rent big busses and set up displays in the parking lot of the convention center we were at. It's all part of the game.
We eventually bought them all.
When I call the front desk of a hotel and ask them for a good hamburger joint, their first answer is not "the hotel restaurant".
Trying to artificially boost sales by denying consumers other options usually gets you the exact opposite of what you are trying to achieve. There's a lot of examples of this in business history.
Maybe the Hotel will start changing people for pizza deliveries.
I have never seen Stern have a table at Expo but they shuttle people to the factory.
I have always seen Terry's party as more of a customer appreciation, or "glad you could make it out to Pinball Expo and could stop by while you are in town." Seems like the appropriate time for any local pinball business to hold an open house (or tour of facility), when all of their customers are in town. To me, Stern, pinball Life, Expo, all adds to the value of the trip to Chicago.
Quoted from TomGWI:I have never seen Stern have a table at Expo but they shuttle people to the factory.
Maybe Mike should ban that because it's unfair to JJP.
I don't know why I care to be honest, I probably will only make it to expo once in my life. When I do come, it will be to play some awesome games and go to parties like the pinball life one. If I need parts, ill order them online and have them delivered to my house.
Quoted from vdojaq:Mike,
What money is PBL taking if the vendor hall is closed during his open house hours? I don't buy it....and neither does PBL. Nor do most of the Expo attendees.
You need to quit with the Dollar Bill Wirtz way of thinking.
I believe the logic used is that Mike assumes that : The money spent at PBL for merchandise would have 100% been spent at Expo.
I 100% was not spending all my money at EXPO last year. The selection and deals were not that great for what I was looking for. If PBL did not have the open house last year, I was going home with nothing much.
Quoted from pinballlife:Here is a partial list of show specials:
Dot Matrix Displays - $143.00
Williams/Bally WPC-era Chrome Leg Sets - $40.00
Williams/Bally WPC-era Coin Doors - $90.00
PinGulp Drink Caddies - $9.00
Collapsible PinGulp Drink Caddies - $9.00
Standard Playfield Glass - $20.00
Widebody Playfield Glass - $25.00
WPC/WPC-95 Backglass Glass - $15.00
Williams/Bally WPC-era Stainless Steel Lockdown Bars - $50.00
Williams/Bally WPC-era Widebody Stainless Steel Lockdown Bars - $80.00
Metal Cabinet Protector Sets - $12.00
PinCab Cabinet Protector Sets - $12.00
Hey Terry,
Any chance B/W flipper rebuild kits could be added to the specials? I need sets for TAF and TZ.
That would be awesome!?!
Quoted from TomGWI:Maybe the Hotel will start changing people for pizza deliveries.
I have never seen Stern have a table at Expo but they shuttle people to the factory.
Jody from STERN works hand in hand with Marco...You know the huge rigging with T.v's and about 12 New pinball Machines!!!
Quoted from ilovegames007:Jody from STERN works hand in hand with Marco...You know the huge rigging with T.v's and about 12 New pinball Machines!!!
Yeah last year. Don't remember that set up before then. Never saw a Stern employee in the booth just Marco employees. But your right I guess they do have a booth in the Marco's booth.
Those TV setups have been there at least the last 2 years.
My question on that, why only the most recent game!? Why not bring at least one example of every game that's in production? Sure, pump your newest with TV's or whatever, but it's almost laughable that they (probably) won't have a TAV, or Metallica in the Expo hall, simply because they were released at the wrong time of the year.
Quoted from centerflank:Hey Terry,
Any chance B/W flipper rebuild kits could be added to the specials? I need sets for TAF and TZ.
That would be awesome!?!
NO, you have to pay full price!
Quoted from Jetzxi:NO, you have to pay full price!
I thought it would be double for him. 
Quoted from Deaconblooze:My question on that, why only the most recent game!? Why not bring at least one example of every game that's in production? Sure, pump your newest with TV's or whatever, but it's almost laughable that they (probably) won't have a TAV, or Metallica in the Expo hall, simply because they were released at the wrong time of the year.
There are plenty of people that come to this show that haven't played a number of the latest titles from Stern. You'd think they would definitely have at least one of each still in production to give those people a chance to try for the first time, and maybe they would be leaving the show saying they are going to purchase one now.
Congrats on the upgraded facility. Wish I could come this year to see it. Next year for sure. THanks Terry.
Mike, this has soured me on Expo in general. I'm sure there are people who would not attend Expo and patronize your vendors if the pinball life open house was not part of the weekend.
Quoted from mikepin:SAy what you want I have talked to 3 vendors who were not happy about shuttle in the past just this week. Its up to them whatbthey tell you No its not because I want your money I let it go for years BUt instead of you saying thanks to expo you intstead chose to have yoor people wear and give out tshirts last year that had the little boy PISSING on pinball expo logo WAS that cute or called for?
No......that's funny as hell!!!
Quoted from TomGWI:I have never seen Stern have a table at Expo but they shuttle people to the factory.
Stern has had a booth at Expo, at least some years. Selling T Shirts etc.
Mike and Rob pay for the buses to take people to Stern and back.
LTG : )
Quoted from LTG:Stern has had a booth at Expo, at least some years. Selling T Shirts etc.
Mike and Rob pay for the buses to take people to Stern and back.
LTG : )
Must have missed there booth the last 7 years. I have seen them sell merchandise at the factory during the tour but never in the exhibit hall so my apologizes.
I realize Rob and Mike pay for he buses but I assumed it was part of he cost of the tour.
As I remember, the shuttle to PBL was $10, but you were given a ten dollar voucher towards parts.
Quoted from Deaconblooze:My question on that, why only the most recent game!? Why not bring at least one example of every game that's in production?
This would make the Stern booth a lot better.
The Stern booth was a disappointment last year.......all X Men.
Great if you are thinking about buying an X Men,but would have liked to try out some of Sterns other offerings that they had at the time.
Quoted from pinballlife:I hope to see many of you at our open house. It is always nice to see old friends and put faces to the names of the new friends we have made over the past year. Despite all the drama (if that's what this has been), it will be a blast.
Terry.
I'll be there with bells on. And while I appreciate the fact that I don't need to buy a thing to attend the party.....I will be, because lets face it, you have great prices AND great customer service.
This will be my very first PBL party but it certainly won't be my last order (or my first).
Quoted from Malibu-SS:This would make the Stern booth a lot better.
The Stern booth was a disappointment last year.......all X Men.
Great if you are thinking about buying an X Men,but would have liked to try out some of Sterns other offerings that they had at the time.
Yeah I sure they want to promote their latest and greatest but would be nice to have a few others.
I have the money and the time to make the Expo, but have passed a few times because of silly stuff like this. If I did go, it would sure as heck include renting a shuttle for my pals and I to go the the PBL party!
Quoted from Rarehero:Maybe Mike and Terry will make up and perform this song live at Expo:
» YouTube video
Maybe YOU and MIKE could end up FRIends forEVER??
Do people honestly buy a lot of things at these shows? Personally I'm going to have a suitcase and a carry on already for the 4 hour flight, and while a few small things might be no big deal I'd honestly rather just pay the $14 in shipping or whatever to get a nice big box of goodies like I always do. From Pinball Life as well as other vendors, since let's face it, no one carries everything you need in one spot.
Quoted from Aurich:Do people honestly buy a lot of things at these shows? Personally I'm going to have a suitcase and a carry on already for the 4 hour flight, and while a few small things might be no big deal I'd honestly rather just pay the $14 in shipping or whatever to get a nice big box of goodies like I always do. From Pinball Life as well as other vendors, since let's face it, no one carries everything you need in one spot.
Pinball Inc, Mirco and other vendors have "show specials" so much of their stuff is cheaper than their website and no shipping charges. There are some vendors that are not web based businesses that sell used and hard to find parts.
I don't go to Expo to shop, per se. If I know I need something specific I will try and get it at the show. But for me, EXPO is about the people and playing games. Shopping is towards the bottom of the list.
Quoted from LTG:Stern has had a booth at Expo, at least some years. Selling T Shirts etc.
Mike and Rob pay for the buses to take people to Stern and back.
LTG : )
No, Mike and Rob sell tickets for the bus to take you to Stern, not a freebee.
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