Chuck, I know Meteor in competition is very one dimensional. At home, you can go for WOW's all the way up to seven. Max out your multiplier and then focus on the spinner. The great thing about this game is that the spinner value is constantly changing. It's not just a lit spinner that stays lit. You always have to work the METEOR drops to advance your spinner. For me, that's where the high replayability comes from.

I think it would be great actually... But Pinside would have a Meltdown. I'm all in for innovative rules and ways to screw you over.

Dragonfist!! It's rare to find one, but I highly recommend it. I'd buy one if I could find one that wasn't ridiculously priced.
In a loosely similar feature, the game has an LED numeric counter... for the maximum # of spins, with memory just like a high score to keep it as a goal for all other future players to chase. I wish this feature were on more games!

Quicksilver
barracora

There really isn't a comparable game to TNA that I can think of, but Banzai Run is close in some ways. It is brutally fast with a straightforward objective that has unforgiving shots. It also has an upper playfield unlike any other that requires more skill to hit the shots than the upper TNA playfield. It does have one ramp, but it's more of a one way orbit that's super fast.

The music is also quite good like other Sys 11s.

That being said, I love my Banzai, but have a TNA on order!

Flash Gordon is similar and totally brutal.

Even Bowen gets killed in these games!

If it is the speed you like, a lot of the older games play blazing fast with a clear coat job, nice wax job and a flipper rebuild. It just makes a whole new game out of them.

I was the same way. Thankfully, I played TNA early in my pinball "career" and have fallen in love with classic no-ramp games. Currently have Flash Gordon and Paragon that fit that mold. Also have a TWD for a modern brutal game. Would love to have a classic Stern to add to the "classic bank" that ironically enough, TNA will be lined up with. I think they all fall within a similar enough category, where the game has no mercy and punishes you for flailing. They all say, "Press Start again...I dare you."

Yeah, when I made my comment about split playfields I was thinking about the lower playfield on Hardbody / BMX with the upper playfield on Flash Gordon. With Hardbody / BMX, the way the ramps / orbits either feed the upper playfield or loop around remind me of Total Nuclear Annihilation.

Hehe, fascinating...

Well the trick is to figure out what *you* like about that single flipper upper playfield with no drop targets. Then go search for something simliar in youtube and ipdb.org

Personally, I much prefer upper PFs with a drop target bank or two, and preferably two flippers.

I actually can't think another upper PF designed like that with no drop target banks in early solid states... other than perhaps an actual bagatelle itself -- and I refuse to own games with bagatelles. (Sorry Catacomb)

-mof

I’d have to say TNA most reminds me of Pinbot.

Same. Imagine having rules that would let a player literally steal points from another player. It'd have to be 100% skill oriented though. None of that random award "catch up" nonsense Gottlieb did.

Like a quality game of Mario Party, It'd be fun to have a pinball machine that ruins friendships while playing.

If I had to pick a single game to compare it to (layout-wise-only) -- I'd go with Silverball Mania.

1. uneventful upper playfield
2. only 2 long shots to reach the upper playfield
3. dangerous and cramped lower playfield
4. no drop target banks

-mof

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So when do we get Stars/Meteor/Seawitch VE?

Gary said that they would be too expensive to make. They would have to charge close to Stern Pro price and he doesn't think it would sell. I think a lot of people would buy brand new 4-4.5K Star Gazers and Quicksilvers.

Interesting... I would definitely NOT call TNA's upper playfield uneventful.
Not to mention that Silverball Mania is about as far as you could get on the opposite end of the spectrum than TNA in terms of gameplay.

Although there's an interesting similarity in getting lots of ball saves on both.

Please reread the part where I explicit say layout-wise-only.

That means no rules, no sounds, no lights...

Just let the ball fall into that area and flail away. Not much going on in that enclosed space.

One flipper versus one sling. Not a dream matchup in my book.

And... I was explicitly saying Silverball Mania has an uneventful upper playfield.

Reading!
-mof

Ok... then I'll posit that doing comparisons of pins strictly on layout alone is not meaningful.
Plus, the context of this thread is captured by: "Anyone have any old games that are fast without ramps?"
Comparing TNA to Silverball Mania as similar is ridiculous. Sorry.

Even to stay within your layout-only comparison, the similarities are that they both have two lower flippers, two slings, traditional inlane/outlanes, and a tight lower PF. There are dozens of other early SS share that distinction -- thus, singling out Silverball doesn't make sense. And Silverball's play is zzzzzzzzzz compared to TNA.

Last, I maintain that TNA's upper PF far from uneventful -- in any context.

Disagree 100%

It's *mostly* what I do when I make a purchase decision, other than listen to the sound... thus the early 80's collection.
Early solid states have my favorite shot maps -- with minimal rules.

When critiquing pins -- my focus happens to be on the geometry and physics first, and how good that feels. Everyone has a different approach.
-mof

Again, I shall kindly ask you to please re-read a post.
It has numbered points in it to help guide how I came to my subjective hypothesis...

And... I'm pretty sure this is the part of the thread, where you just let people toss their opinions out there and just let them hit the floor if you don't like em...

I think we're trying to help some dude make a decision about whether anything out there is similar to TNA, and what about TNA he likes so he can seek other games.
-mof

Sorry mof, not the best comparison. I also read it the same way that snailman did.

Now that I think of it, the reactor targets remind me of the visor too.

Came in expecting Seawitch...

...leaving satisfied

In my opinion, the best comparisons will have numbered or bulleted reasons listing how they formed their opinions.

Every opinion thrown out so far, including mine, can be shot down -- as no two games are identical.

-mof

This has officially turned into a mof thread. Too many questions, too much explaining, & the life just sucked right out of it.

I mean no offense

Hey, at least he's backing up his opinion with numbered points!
Respect.
-mof

1] i would.
2] i have.
3] and i will in the future.

Have you played?

Let the numbers hit the floor. Let the numbers hit the floor.

I read your entire post(s). No need to re-read it. Putting a numbered list on your argument doesn't make it any less wrong or less subjective.
I respect your opinion. I simply find your comparison of TNA to Silverball along with why... perplexing, and inaccurate.
To each their own.

In this aim: to the OP... if mof has convinced you that Silverball Mania is similar to TNA, please go play both (or watch video of both) before drawing your own conclusion. TNA is fast, frenetic, adrenaline rush pinball with really cool rules and shots/returns that you always have you on your toes.
Silverball Mania plays like this: (here you go, mof
1) Plunge center lane.
2) Get control on a flipper.
3) Backhand the horseshoe on that flipper's side.
4) Dead bounce or catch the return from the horseshoe.
5) Repeat forever to max your Bonus, BonusX, and lite EB.
6) Wish you were playing one of the many other SS pins that were mentioned in this thread instead of Silverball Mania.

By the way, mof, you've got a decent chunk of those other SS pins I'm referring to. Nice collection!!

nope, he only watches videos and then posts endlessly about games he does not like and supposedly have major issues with geometry even though everyone else that actually plays the game digs it...

What I'd suggest, is if you are wanting to explore single-level games, but do not favor old game sound packages, to consider trying out some 1990+ single-level games. There actually are a few:

Breakshot (Capcom 1996)
Harley-Davidson (Bally/Williams 1991)
Silver Slugger (Premier 1990)
Vegas (Premier 1990)
Deadly Weapon (Premier 1990)
Title Fight (Premier 1990)
Car Hop (Premier 1991)
Hoops (Premier 1991)

The Premier games were the "street level" experiments by Premier (to make simpler, cheaper games). Harley-Davidson was the Bally/Williams response to target the same market Premier was going for. Breakshot was designed to appeal to more classic pinball concepts (Capcom planned a series called Capcom Classics, and this was the first and only one to come out for it).

Breakshot I think is a lot of fun; it's the only one of these with a DMD and I think the sound package is pretty good for its time. Challenging game, I think it's relatively fast (of course not TNA fast).

I own a Silver Slugger. Lots of flow on it and pretty fast, but I'd say it plays safer than Breakshot seems to. I have a review on this site regarding it if you'd like more detailed specifics.

A lot of tournament players seem fond of Hoops but I have no time on it, nor have I played any of the others I listed, but perhaps some others can weigh in with thoughts (or if there are some other, more modern, single-level games I missed).

Anyway, I know you said 1980s, but if you're wanting more advanced lighting and sound features I just wanted to note there were a few single-level games from the 90s you could consider.

yes.

and for a game so highly touted for its lighting, it was next to impossible to see the ball against the black playfield art in low lit conditions. owners with dimly lit gamerooms are in for a surprise.

photo: as featured at arcade expo 5.0, banning, ca.

234 (resized).jpg

Our day will come
If we just wait a while
No tears for us
Think love and wear a smile

WHAAAT? No 3month buildup to the release of the critical game flaw? You're slipping.

Nice one!
Mof

heres another pic from the ayce gogi tna launch party

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I never thought about how blinding an LCD could be to a player in a dark room -- and how you just can't remove bulbs from the display to calm it down. I usually play moderns with LCDs in bars with some lighting, and haven't noticed a reflection issue yet... I'll have to look out for that.

yikes.
-mof

We all know that camera settings have a huge impact on game lighting in images. See any of the Pinstadium comparison pics. You really have to be there in person to appreciate it. I have had no issues seeing the ball during gameplay. If TWIPYs were any indication, I think TNA holds up well on it's own without any poorly taken pictures.

Anyways, the upper pf is an integral part of the game and needs to be used in order to progress, hence I always wonder about the criticism of an "underused" upper pf.

Very true...

And... every one of my solid states that I've added spotlights to on the slings so far, look much better in the dark in the lower center PF:

* high speed
* cyclone
* space shuttle

-mof

TNA lighting is spectaculor and your are blind, deaf, and dumb if you think otherwise.

Sorry, but super easy to see even in a dimly lit room. GreenHornet you lose more and more with every passing review which highlights things that you think of cons which are pros of so many others. Pathetic display of attention whoring and agenda. You shuold probably stick with the 3 month build up for the nothing burger next time.

Let the numbers hit the floooooooooooooorr!!!

love the personal attacks.
keep em coming.

here are some more pics as posted by pinsiders with their games in their natural state.
different cameras, different conditions, different resolutions.
it is impossible to unsee that swath of black across the middle of the playfield.
in the words of los bravos. black is black.

You see the world through your cynical eyes
You're a troubled young man I can tell
And you're fooling yourself if you don't believe it
You're kidding yourself if you don't believe it

i assure you if spooky offered alternative playfield art packages where the black art could be replaced with
1] lighter natural wood, or
2] the pink/yellow/orange scheme between the flippers
there would/should be some takers.

if allowing players to best see the ball was a consideration,
there definitely was a better choice for playfield art.

funny, i see it as im the one gaining traction and you are the one quickly becoming not worthy of my time.

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I really don't think you have played these games you complain about. I've played TNA in 4different locations and never had an issue. You can't go by pictures.

Yeah, I have never had any issues seeing the ball in the middle of the playfield. The GI I put into this game is actually quite bright. Also, the silver ball stands out pretty well agains the black background of the middle of the playfield. I really love how it turned out actually.

@greenhornet, I am sorry you do not like the game, it will not be for everyone. I knew that as soon as I built the first one.

--Scott

If he don't like the game, I'm sure there is somebody else out there that would like to buy it.

He doesn't own one. Just likes to bag on the game whenever given the chance. I don't quite understand.

Sooo you have to own a game to hate it?

Maybe because it doesn't come with those cheap repetitive plastic ramps lots of hobbyists have become accustomed to? Or it doesn't play music from a band that 30 years ago sold out Madison Square Garden? I couldn't tell you...