(Topic ID: 233111)

2019 New Pinball purchase will be taxed.

By mnpinball

11 months ago

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  • 586 posts
  • 154 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 months ago by SadSack
  • Topic is favorited by 19 Pinsiders


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    Topic index (key posts)

    8 key posts have been marked in this topic

    Post #297 Comments from a distributor. Posted by KingPinGames (11 months ago)

    Post #304 More info from a distributor. Posted by KingPinGames (11 months ago)

    Post #355 Economic nexus test, uses Louisiana as an example. Posted by iceman44 (11 months ago)

    Post #415 Comment from distributor. Posted by Gexchange (11 months ago)

    Post #465 State by state tracker. Posted by flynnibus (11 months ago)

    Post #505 Some expierence for 2019 and suggestions. Posted by Pinzap (11 months ago)

    Post #513 Break down of thresholds state by state Posted by Hemispheres (11 months ago)

    Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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    #14 11 months ago
    Quoted from pascal-pinball:

    So you don't pay taxes on a new pinballmachine in te USA?
    We pay 21% taxen on a new pinballmachine !!!

    Were 13% sales tax on everything here. It’s kinda hard listening to people bitch about having to finally pay sales taxes. It’s just the way of life for lots of people.

    Welcome to the rest of the world.

    #18 11 months ago
    Quoted from Lermods:

    It’s just a money grab by politicians,

    That’s one way to look at it. I differ in my point of view, not all taxes are useless.

    I could think of a hundred things that America could improve in your country with more tax money. Alas, instead of using it for good social programs or schools, or roads ect... it will probably be used for something stupid like military spending or border control, or just used to line the fat pockets of the rich in your failed system. Yes, I believe that any country as rich as the USA, with poverty as high as the USA is a failed system.

    #46 11 months ago

    Hey I finally got a moderation notice on pinside There’s a first for everything.

    This tax may be a pain in the ass, but I don’t have sympathy for the people that now have to deal with it.

    #52 11 months ago

    Tesla reduced their prices by $2000 to help offset government credits that are reducing, to help keep their product affordable.

    I wonder if stern will reduce their price to alleviate some of this added cost.

    I keed, I keed

    #69 11 months ago
    Quoted from Lermods:

    There are no distributors in NJ, so I will now have to pay sales tax on a game to level the playing field for what competition? If I am going to be subject to this tax on new games, I’ll just have it delivered to Delaware and get it there. Increases in taxes almost never generate the expected revenue as people either change their consumption patterns or find ways around it.

    True. There are always people that look to skirt around the laws. Doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.

    #77 11 months ago
    Quoted from WackyBrakke:

    The Colorado (CO) state sales tax rate is currently 2.9%. Depending on local municipalities, the total tax rate can be as high as 11.2%. Colorado is a “home rule” state. Local-level tax rates in the state of Colorado are quite complex compared against local-level tax rates in other states.

    Talk about a failed system. Who decides what section of the population pays more? Divided by zip codes?

    #93 11 months ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    I'm pretty sure we ALL pay taxes for the betterment of ALL citizens. Been that way for a LONG time.

    I dont know if I can agree with such a broad statement. As an outsider it doesn't always look that way

    #97 11 months ago
    Quoted from WackyBrakke:

    It’s based on the county you live in and the city boundaries. For example the city of Denver vs the city of Littleton. I happen to live in unincorporated Douglas county so ours is lower because we don’t have a local city government to support. So my sales tax is based upon the state at 2.9% plus the county sales tax. Then there are other add-on’s. Such as RTD(our public transit system), if where you live is serviced by RTD there is an additional sales tax added on. Etc.
    For online sales you pay the tax based upon point of delivery, where you have the item shipped to....typically your home. Vs a brick and mortar purchase. If I drive to Best Buy in Denver I can expect to pay a lot more sales tax because of where they are located.
    For example Game Exchange is located in Denver. If I drive there and pickup my game I pay 7.5% sales tax. If I have them deliver it to my home I pay 4% sales tax.
    Correction: Apparently Denver’s total sales tax rate is now 8.31%

    Where do property taxes factor into these expenses and services? Property tax money should be for your city services like bus transit, not local sales tax.

    #120 11 months ago
    Quoted from CrazyLevi:

    Yeah it’s almost as if the bullshit tax cuts we all got aren’t really gonna help most of us.

    Your just cluing in now?

    #138 11 months ago
    Quoted from imagamejunky:

    On soapbox...
    Now we can pay even MORE taxes so the F-ing libs can give it away to the scumbag homeless, scumbag drug addicts, and scumbags who sit on their asses instead of actually working!
    Off soapbox...

    Nice ta meet you, throughout my life I’ve fallen into more than one of those categories

    #152 11 months ago
    Quoted from ralphwiggum:

    And I am sure it was as luxurious as all these "hard working" think you had it as well.... I can't think of anything I would want more than being a homeless drug addict. Sounds like a ton of fun.....

    Started from the bottom, now we’re here. I’m very fortunate to have a life now that can afford a NIB game. It takes decades of hard work and proper life choices to turn your life around.

    #193 11 months ago
    Quoted from srmonte:

    My friends the canadians,
    I have really wanted to get me a nib pin. I need to have someone else pay for it, since I cannot afford one. Please give me a step by step format on how I may achieve this goal. I love socialism so so much.

    Don’t quite think you get it. I have never met anyone that thinks that way.

    #202 11 months ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    The top “1 percent ers..” pay 40% of the total federal income tax collected
    The top 10% pays 71% of the total
    The bottom 45% pay Zero Federal income tax
    Fact: No matter how you slice it rate wise, you aren’t squeezing any more juice out of the “rich”. They will plan around it or move
    Need to look at 1/2 the population that pays ZERO
    When you lower taxes, oh wait, unemployment goes to record lows AND wages rise, including the minimum wage across the country and voluntarily for Amazon, Walmart, etc
    You want to ration Healthcare? Move to Canada
    Many of you should be applauding these sales taxes, but you only want higher taxes as long as it doesn’t apply to you!

    The top 10 percent have NO IDEA how bad the bottom 45 percent have it. Pay people a good living wage and they will be more then happy to contribute their share of taxes.

    Can’t take blood from a stone.

    #220 11 months ago
    Quoted from iceman44:

    The bottom 45% have no idea how bad people outside of the USA and Canada “have it”
    Gimme a F ing break

    I don’t think I get what your saying here.

    I commented that the discrepancy between the elite and poor in America is greater then most of the elite recognize.

    Your rebuttal is that the poor in your country are doing better then then the poor in (3rd world nations?). How is that a just comparison. People are starving, but they should just be happy to be there and not want a better life?

    Saying your poor are better then other poor won’t win you any nice guy awards.

    #222 11 months ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    That's the problem. The really rich (and those who never had to work for it) completely lose perspective. I'm not trying to hate. I don't know any of you, and I know not all rich people are bad. but don't come at me like I'm some welfare check holder.

    Most that make over 250k a year don’t understand how bad the struggle is when you make 30k; and 250k a year does not make you rich.

    #236 11 months ago
    Quoted from usandthem:

    The idea of people pulling themselves up by the bootstraps and becoming rich in America is an exploded myth.

    The American dream has been a lie for years, most will never become millionaires, but as long as they keep believing everything will be ok.

    #252 11 months ago
    Quoted from yzfguy:

    You seem to have way too much animosity toward your neighbor to the south.

    I don’t hate America, or Americans. Just sometimes I feel that there could be a better way for all, not just some.

    Please don’t begin to believe that just because we have different view points that I think your somewhat less of a person. Disagreements move conversations forward and help change perspective on situations.

    My father and I are on total political polar opposites, but I still love him and value his opinions. Even if I dont agree.

    #262 11 months ago

    To throw salt on wound, here in Ontario there’s not only the 13% sales tax we pay on NIB games, but we also have to deal with fluctuating currency exchange rates.

    You plan to buy a game in 2 weeks, the dollar drops by a penny and suddenly your paying hundreds more in unexpected cost. You can plan and save for taxes, but we don’t even know what the price is until we go pay. The price is calculated that day.

    #266 11 months ago
    Quoted from Monte:

    You should move south to America!

    There’s a good chance I’d get denied at the border. They’d probably let me through, but I haven’t tested it in the last decade and the world has changed a lot since then.

    Ya know, them bad lifestyle choices might comeback to annoy me.

    #282 11 months ago
    Quoted from AFM95:

    Can I politely ask if you've ever lived in a 2nd or 3rd world country? I have, and most of the bottom 45 percent have it pretty good in the United States.

    No I haven’t.

    At work I daily deal with people going through very difficult times, people at the bottom of society. I regularly see shit that would blow your mind, and that’s just the way of life for some people. I also deal with people that are considerably well off just as often. Daily I will travel from public housing to multi million dollar mansions. The dichotomy amazes me regularly, and most people have no idea how the other side lives.

    My experience with the 3rd world is from the media and vicariously through my friends experiences, but I don’t have first hand knowledge of their lives.

    But to try and steer this conversation back on track we’re talking about new pinball purchases and how to best avoid paying any new sales taxes, right?

    #288 11 months ago
    Quoted from usandthem:

    The reality is that this tax has just upped the cost of the hobby.

    But if someone has been buying local all along and paying their local sales tax all along then nothing would be different.

    This will only affect people that have ordered online from out of state to avoid their local taxation. Correct?

    #293 11 months ago
    Quoted from cantbfrank:

    What is the justification of taxing individuals on private party sales. The whole value of the product was already originally taxed. Isn’t the double taxation.

    Ya this is total bullshit, but like it’s been said, in the auto market it’s been enforced through registration. Private sales have no way of being enforced, so it never happens, although you’re supposed to report it on your taxes. No one ever dose.

    Now there will be enforcement for online sales.

    So, ya, double taxation is happening on the second hand market and is not right.

    I’d be cautious even posting a for sale add on pinside. Even if it’s a private sale, it’s been facilitated through the Internet on a public website. IRS catches a sale you didn’t report and I bet that won’t be a fun process.

    #331 11 months ago
    Quoted from AFM95:

    I'm in the same thought process as you. If I sell my DILE today, I would take a $1,000 loss which I'm okay with.
    If I bought a DILE now at $9,700, I'm now taking a massive $1,700 hit when I sell (not including $300 for shipping if you paid for it).
    1. That makes me wonder if the secondary market will see an increase in price on NIB games.
    2. I will be much more cautious on what I buy, the frequency that I buy NIB, and I will certainly hold on to my NIB longer.

    I brought this up years ago and nobody wanted to take a hit for taxes paid. So I will fully expect people to ask more on the secondary market. If you pay more up front, you will want to sell for more. Unfortunately nobody cares if you had to pay more up front.


    #393 11 months ago
    Quoted from Who-Dey:

    Its not a matter of someone who can afford 7k can afford 7.5k. Its a matter of principal

    Principals or morals?

    I will only buy a NIB as long as I don’t have to pay the taxes for where I live. I don’t want to move to a tax free state. I want to live where I am and not contribute my share to my local government. As long as I don’t have to pay what I should have been paying all along.

    If you can’t afford to pay your taxes then it’s not a matter of principle. If you refuse to pay your taxes it’s not a matter of principal. IMHO it’s a matter of entitlement. I’m to rich, smart, or savvy to have to do my part. Taxes are only payed by schleps that can’t find how to avoid them.

    If these are your principles, then I think your immoral

    Principles are subjective, morals are definable are right and wrong. Avoiding to pay the taxes you rightfully owe is wrong.

    #398 11 months ago
    Quoted from TheHueManatee:

    I work for the feds and have seen firsthand tax money being pissed away left, right and center.
    There's a term they use near the end of the fiscal year called "March madness." If the budget for the year isn't spent by the last month of the fiscal year (April) then they'll get a smaller budget the following year.
    So to ensure they never get a smaller budget, they go through "March madness" to spend the remaining budget money before April 1st. (New air conditioners, kureg coffee machines, chairs, desks, fleet vehicles,etc)
    So when people defend any new taxes it really makes my blood boil. The amount of taxpayer money being wasted is mind boggling!

    Nobody’s defending poor government spending.
    Nobody’s defending new taxes.

    The new enforcement is what people are mad about. The tax was there all along, they were just more easily able to avoid them before. And now the line in the sand has been drawn, not because of new taxes, because people refuse to pay their share.

    If you don’t like the tax in your State, move, don’t be immortal and avoid the right thing to do.

    Nobody likes to pay tax, but if nobody actually pays tax then your country won’t exist. It’s kinda how the whole thing works.

    #401 11 months ago
    Quoted from underlord:

    Short term blindness. America has an epidemic of it. Long term thinkers are boring.

    Well said.

    #424 11 months ago
    Quoted from pinlawyer:

    The right thing to do is resist with everything we've got.

    Again, I disagree. I pay my taxes for every purchase I make, without complaint.

    This isn’t a new tax, you just can’t avoid it as easily as you used to.

    IMHO refusing to pay taxes is the same as not paying your government. Anyone/anything without an income won’t last. Taxes are the way your government collects money to keep the country going. Without income the government would collapse or be shutdown. Whom runs the country when nobody’s getting paid to do it? The military? They want your money too. How about the state? Nope. They also want your money to stay a float. Municipalities? Same.

    You might not like my socialist view, that’s ok you don’t have to like me, or my view, or my country. But the fact is that if everything is tax free then the world wouldn’t work.

    America’s #1 export is debt to China. If taxes don’t pay for that what will?

    #426 11 months ago
    Quoted from fxdwg:

    government seems to want more and more of our hard earned money via taxes

    Yet everyone wants to give less and less.

    Quoted from fxdwg:

    yet they seem to waste more and more or spend it on what whoever is in charge wants, and not whats best for the American people.

    This is a separate issue. All governments are wasteful. Could I do a better job then they are? sure I could, in theory, but realistically running a country isn’t easy. For the most part America is doing well, so how bad is it really?

    Quoted from fxdwg:

    our countries are very different.

    True dat

    #428 11 months ago

    Will dealers just avoid selling across country? Buy local/sell local. Or is the profit enough to deal with cross state tax laws? Or sell enough to just skirt the limit, then pass on sales to another dealer?

    By having individual dealers setting individual prices stern forced their distributors to complete against each other. Without having a national dealer network themselves stern pushes their bullshit (maintenance and taxes?) onto the middleman. Dealers don’t help each other out now, do they? But you’ll have to ask yourself as a reseller, is it worth it?

    #431 11 months ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    pay sales tax on a new car, you pay sales tax on a used car...etc.

    Buy anything used from a store like goodwil, double taxes.

    It happens all the time.

    #433 11 months ago

    I come on here and say. You gotta pay taxes for everthing that your supposed to pay taxes for. just because you've used a loophole for years doesn't make it right. Now the loophole is closed and it's time to do what you should have been doing all along.

    I get called a stupid Canadian, I know nothing about this. Well, ok. Attack me personally. I'm ok with that. Your opinion of me doesn't matter to me.

    Now just to suppose for a min.

    Suppose an IRS agent was reading this thread and came on here and said. "Well guys, you really should be paying sales tax for your district." Would they get blasted like i am.

    My opinion are mine, and they're just opinions. I haven't needed to personally attack anyone on here to feel better about myself

    #436 11 months ago


    Thanks for the respectful response.

    Quoted from AFM95:

    You lean left, believe everyone should have access to everything even if they don't pay for it

    I believe in a shared system, not pay to play, remember not everything is free to everyone in Canada.

    But there's no way you will convince me that if you can buy a $5k toy, that you can't afford the sales tax on it. Especially if you live in a area that you should be paying that tax. Regardless of buying it online or at a brick and mortar store.

    I believe if your address requires sales tax then you man up and pay it. Dont look for ways to avoid it. If you truly hate sales taxes in your area, move to a less taxed area. Taxes are here for a reason and avoiding them only helps your own pocket. And some people are ok with that, I'm not. Maybe it's my poor morals in wanting to do my part?

    #439 11 months ago
    Quoted from yzfguy:

    I don't think that your calling another country's system "failed" makes it easy to listen to your viewpoint

    After all that I've learned on the American tax system in the last couple days, it's hard to say it's not failing on many levels.

    Canada is failing in many areas to. The idea is to work toward something better.

    (Maybe to much time with family over the holidays has got me a little more salty then usual. I need to smoke a joint and calm the fuck down)

    #442 11 months ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    It's like this whole conversation has went over your head. Please read up on American history.

    Maybe this is all just a case of the Dunning Kruger affect. I'm to stupid to realize how stupid I am when talking about something outside my experience. I'll give ya that. Could be.

    Quoted from Fezmid:

    Whenever I read your posts, I'm reminded when I lived in Niagara Falls, NY and used to see Canadians come over the border to buy clothes. They'd sit in the parking lot, rip all of the tags off the clothes, litter the parking lot, and then put all the clothes on so that they could go back to Canada and not pay tax on anything (they'd wear a half dozen t-shirts, a couple pairs of pants, etc, all at once to avoid taxes.). Just sayin'.

    Yup, (this ain't me) but I wouldn't doubt it. This country is filled with tax avoiders too. I still dont agree with it.

    #448 11 months ago
    Quoted from Zablon:

    So you say that it is a failed system, but think people should just blindly agree to everything and just throw money at it? Makes sense....................................................

    No. Quite the opposite. You live in a community that provides services to your neighborhood. For whatever reason they couldn't make ends meet and imposed a sales tax to offset spending. (I'm not arguing that your community is spending it well) To avoid THAT sales tax people have made purchases online from outside their community. (I disagree with avoiding the tax, not online purchasing) Now the Gov has made it enforceable that your community can collect sales tax that was lost through this loophole (they're trying to fix a broken system, is that a bad thing?)

    If everyone always paid the proper taxes for their area already, would the Gov need to close a loophole? Or should the loophole remain and communities suffer lost revenue from the people living there?

    Sorry. I love this kind of debate, but I have to work now. Ya know. Pay the tax man and all that.

    2 weeks later
    #581 10 months ago
    Quoted from greenhornet:

    sounds as though its time for everyone to come clean.

    I think this is the best course of action.

    Quoted from Gexchange:

    It sucks, someones going to try and skate and get caught and owe a TON of back taxes.

    I don’t think this sucks, if you avoid the law and get caught, it’s on you, no one should feel sorry for you.

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