(Topic ID: 309413)

SOLVED! 2 pins - 1 subwoofer - Audio Line Mixer?

By NightTrain

2 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 21 posts
  • 8 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by mbwalker
  • Topic is favorited by 6 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic Gallery

    View topic image gallery

    pasted_image (resized).png
    2FB8523E-5079-4DB9-B311-B518344DADB5 (resized).jpeg
    adjuster (resized).JPG
    RCA plug (resized).JPG
    speaker (resized).jpg
    splitter (resized).JPG
    subwoofer (resized).jpg
    #1 2 years ago

    Hey guys. Need a little help here from the audio guys.

    I always run external subwoofers on my pins. I've mostly got these Sony SA-W2500's. They work great and sound great. Even better, they have two inputs. So I always run 2 pins off of one sub.

    I've got AC/DC and Metallica next to each other though, and it doesn't work so hot. When I turn the sub up loud enough to thump for Metallica, it's WAY too loud for AC/DC. I'm looking for a sort of audio line mixer or controller before I go and just buy another subwoofer.

    I always just solder my speaker wire to the cabinet subwoofer. So then I run those wires to the back of my subwoofer. They don't have connectors on them.

    I found this 4-channel line mixer, but this would require me to have connectors on the wires. Does anyone know if there is a mixer that I can just plug bare wire into it and mix the two channels?

    Thanks!

    splitter (resized).JPGsplitter (resized).JPGsubwoofer (resized).jpgsubwoofer (resized).jpg

    #2 2 years ago

    I think you could get away with a variable resistor (aka a potentiometer, often called a volume
    knob) attached to the louder one.

    I had these little ones you snap into the speaker wire but I can’t find where to get them now. I’ll try a better search after I have my coffee.

    #3 2 years ago

    I have the same issue and have not yet tried it, but the plan is to try a few potentiometers from Amazon. https://www.amazon.com/Potentiometers/b In theory you would put one in line on the louder of the two pins and adjust it until the volume sounded right. I tried to steal one from a cheap set of headphones but the wires were way too small. I threw something like this in line into a High Speed that was too loud and it worked perfectly. https://www.amazon.com/Potentiometers/b . I did the same thing on a Goldentee to add external sound. The only issue is I don't know off the top of my head what size to get.

    #4 2 years ago

    This guide might be helpful as well.

    https://soundcertified.com/how-to-reduce-tweeter-volume/

    It says it's for tweeters but same principles would apply to a subwoofer signal.

    #5 2 years ago

    Yeah I was thinking about just using a potentiometer of some sort, but they all seem to have 3 prongs on them. How do you wire that?

    Below was my simple original thought. I would only need to do it on the louder of the two pins and then just turn it down a bit.

    speaker (resized).jpgspeaker (resized).jpg
    #6 2 years ago
    Quoted from FlippyD:

    This guide might be helpful as well.

    Thanks. I'll check that out!

    #8 2 years ago

    Not really. This doesn't have inputs for just regular speaker wire, which is what I'm using and was the reason for my post.

    On top of this, like all pinball mods, the pricing is outrageous for the product.

    So to get this to work, I'd have to get the Pinsub kits he sells for both machines, and then this mixer on top of that. It would be cheaper to buy an additional subwoofer.

    There has to be a cheaper and better way to do this.

    #9 2 years ago

    I may have a solution. What if I use this adapter to turn give the wire and RCA plug, and then use this level controller?

    RCA plug (resized).JPGRCA plug (resized).JPGadjuster (resized).JPGadjuster (resized).JPG
    #10 2 years ago
    Quoted from NightTrain:

    Not really. This doesn't have inputs for just regular speaker wire, which is what I'm using and was the reason for my post.
    On top of this, like all pinball mods, the pricing is outrageous for the product.
    So to get this to work, I'd have to get the Pinsub kits he sells for both machines, and then this mixer on top of that. It would be cheaper to buy an additional subwoofer.
    There has to be a cheaper and better way to do this.

    Omg. So embarrassed. I must have been brain dead. Re read your original post…. Love the ingenuity on solving for speaker level conversion. My lazy ass would spend $35 for this to convert speaker to RCA and another $10 to $25 for a cheapish line level mixer from sweetwater or Amazon etc and be done. Links below. Should be perfect but same as yours (this one is a bit more flexible- single point for both pin volume controls)

    https://www.crutchfield.com/S-W4MNwGfugmq/p_210MPSHL/Morel-MPS-HL.html?XVINQ=GLX&awkw=425315964428&awat=pla&awnw=g&awcr=343141751718&awdv=m&awug=9032054&gclid=Cj0KCQiA3fiPBhCCARIsAFQ8QzUxYO-3qBC4ApkE3XW4U9lV1GSbC8h5w8lZtMtMgqTF2uPyoibGnMcaAoONEALw_wcB

    https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MX400--behringer-micromix-mx400-line-mixer?mrkgadid=3250494485&mrkgcl=28&mrkgen=gpla&mrkgbflag=1&mrkgcat=brand&acctid=21700000001645388&dskeywordid=92700046937728380&lid=92700046937728380&ds_s_kwgid=58700005283819385&ds_s_inventory_feed_id=97700000007215323&dsproductgroupid=377818384057&product_id=MX400&prodctry=US&prodlang=en&channel=online&storeid=&device=m&network=g&matchtype=&adpos=largenumber&locationid=9032054&creative=228658011809&targetid=aud-994727058445:pla-377818384057&campaignid=741659211&awsearchcpc=1&gclid=Cj0KCQiA3fiPBhCCARIsAFQ8QzWaAjXVqlC7NA7G7JXvZeJrMl9yS7T4xS4LUReqkLIR42ESP8cWXAAaAvInEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

    #11 2 years ago

    I got it figured out. Speaker wire to RCA adapter. RCA to level adjuster. RCA adapter back out speaker wire. Works perfect! $17 all said and done. Cheaper than a second subwoofer.

    2FB8523E-5079-4DB9-B311-B518344DADB5 (resized).jpeg2FB8523E-5079-4DB9-B311-B518344DADB5 (resized).jpeg
    #12 2 years ago

    ALEKOR Phono RCA Male Plug to AV... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08CRX2HF2

    Universal RCA Level Controller... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07D2GDFWZ

    2 months later
    #13 2 years ago

    Electrical engineer here...

    Old thread, but I should probably chime in here. A better way is to convert to a low-level using an adapter, and use the low-level input to the woofer. By using a low-level adapter, it presents a a somewhat high impedance to the pin's audio amplifier (i.e. you're not connecting another woofer in parallel). The audio adapter is used primarily by car audio guys when they need to connect an amplifier/woofers.

    When you used the mixer in your original post, you likely overloaded the mixer.

    The adapter below attaches to the pin's woofer, then it outputs a level appropriate for a mixer or the line connector on an active sub. It also acts as a 'BALUN' (important for some pin's amplifiers, like a SPIKE) and breaks any ground loops.

    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png
    #14 2 years ago
    Quoted from mbwalker:

    Electrical engineer here...
    Old thread, but I should probably chime in here. A better way is to convert to a low-level using an adapter, and use the low-level input to the woofer. By using a low-level adapter, it presents a a somewhat high impedance to the pin's audio amplifier (i.e. you're not connecting another woofer in parallel). The audio adapter is used primarily by car audio guys when they need to connect an amplifier/woofers.
    When you used the mixer in your original post, you likely overloaded the mixer.
    The adapter below attaches to the pin's woofer, then it outputs a level appropriate for a mixer or the line connector on an active sub. It also acts as a 'BALUN' (important for some pin's amplifiers, like a SPIKE) and breaks any ground loops.
    [quoted image]

    On a related question, I have a racing arcade that has 5 speakers. Two above the monitor, 2 in the headrest and one woofer under the seat. The woofer under the seat is supposed to give a tactile feel, so when you go over bumps and stuff it vibrates. The issue is the game is too loud for my house I'd I set the level to feel the bass in the seat. To my understanding, just adding potentiometers to the other 4 speakers to reduce their levels so I can feel the bass but not go deaf from the music would put excess load on the audio board because of the increased resistance, correct? So what would I use to allow the seat level to be louder? It's all speaker wire going to each speaker, I don't have low level line outs to work with. Just a dummy amp where one volume control built in the software controls all the speakers.

    #15 2 years ago
    Quoted from bobwiley:

    On a related question, I have a racing arcade that has 5 speakers. Two above the monitor, 2 in the headrest and one woofer under the seat. The woofer under the seat is supposed to give a tactile feel, so when you go over bumps and stuff it vibrates. The issue is the game is too loud for my house I'd I set the level to feel the bass in the seat. To my understanding, just adding potentiometers to the other 4 speakers to reduce their levels so I can feel the bass but not go deaf from the music would put excess load on the audio board because of the increased resistance, correct? So what would I use to allow the seat level to be louder? It's all speaker wire going to each speaker, I don't have low level line outs to work with. Just a dummy amp where one volume control built in the software controls all the speakers.

    You could use what's called a 'L-Pad', that will keep a constant impedance to the amp, and they are usually rated for higher power.

    Here's a random google search for an L-Pad:

    https://www.simplyspeakers.com/speaker-crossover-l-pad-a-542.html

    #16 2 years ago
    Quoted from mbwalker:

    You could use what's called a 'L-Pad', that will keep a constant impedance to the amp, and they are usually rated for higher power.
    Here's a random google search for an L-Pad:
    https://www.simplyspeakers.com/speaker-crossover-l-pad-a-542.html

    Awesome, thanks,! So I'd need 4 L-pads, correct. 4 to the speakers I want to lower the volume to and the seat speaker (which I want to be louder) I would just leave that as is running directly from the sound board/amp)?

    #17 2 years ago

    Perhaps I was just lucky but I ran 2 pins off of a single PSW-10 subwoofer for years using y-adapters on the RCA ports on the sub and pinnovators sub adapters in each Stern game.

    #18 2 years ago
    Quoted from bobwiley:

    Awesome, thanks,! So I'd need 4 L-pads, correct. 4 to the speakers I want to lower the volume to and the seat speaker (which I want to be louder) I would just leave that as is running directly from the sound board/amp)?

    Yep! One L-Pad for each speaker (in-between the amp and speaker) and seat speaker remains the same. If the speakers are all wired together or maybe in two pairs (excluding the woofer), you can likely get away with fewer L-Pads. In other words, if the amp has two outputs (one for the woofer, one for all the other speakers)...then you'd just need one L-Pad for the surround speakers.

    I'm sort of surprised there's not a menu setting somewhere for the speaker levels? Or is there just one setting for all the speakers?

    Edit: Just saw your comment about the volume control.

    #19 2 years ago
    Quoted from parsonsaj:

    Perhaps I was just lucky but I ran 2 pins off of a single PSW-10 subwoofer for years using y-adapters on the RCA ports on the sub and pinnovators sub adapters in each Stern game.

    Sort of sounds like you are fine since you have some sort of adapter in the pins. I actually have 6 pins (thru the adapters) going into a cheap 6 channel mixer, then to two active subs. Makes it easy to adjust the pins individually via the mixer. And I didn't need to buy a bunch of individual subs.

    3 weeks later
    #20 1 year ago
    Quoted from NightTrain:

    Yeah I was thinking about just using a potentiometer of some sort, but they all seem to have 3 prongs on them. How do you wire that?

    [quoted image]

    You want the center tap and one of the outer legs. The two outer legs are across the entire resistive element, the center tap is what moves with the knob adjustment to vary the output on said tap.

    You can pick either outer leg, but one leg will give you an inverted output (twist CCW to louden rather than CW)

    It is worth noting that audio pots are logarithmic rather than linear taper, so make sure you get an audio pot because it'll be hard to adjust volume with a linear pot

    #21 1 year ago
    Quoted from psomero:

    You want the center tap and one of the outer legs. The two outer legs are across the entire resistive element, the center tap is what moves with the knob adjustment to vary the output on said tap.
    You can pick either outer leg, but one leg will give you an inverted output (twist CCW to louden rather than CW)
    It is worth noting that audio pots are logarithmic rather than linear taper, so make sure you get an audio pot because it'll be hard to adjust volume with a linear pot

    I mentioned the L-pad comment earlier. Using an L-pad will keep the impedance presented to the amp constant.

    Reply

    Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

    Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

    Donate to Pinside

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


    This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/2-pins-1-subwoofer-audio-line-mixer?hl=parsonsaj and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

    Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.