1979 Original Kiss Pinball - How much should I pay?

(Topic ID: 187556)

1979 Original Kiss Pinball - How much should I pay?


By Cherga

1 year ago



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  • Latest reply 4 months ago by mark11aa
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There are 60 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.
#1 1 year ago

Hi all, I'll start by saying I'm new and am looking to obtain my first machine. I've always wanted the original (1979) Kiss pinball and realize that it may not be the greatest and most enjoyable game to some however it is my wish for it to be my first machine. That said, I have an opportunity to buy one. It is in overall good condition, the cabinet paint is in good shape but heavily faded. It also has some wear around the KISS letters in the middle of the playfield, nothing terrible but certainly noticeable. There doesn't appear to be any corrosion visible on any of the boards within the backbox and all of the lights and mechanics appear to be 100% functional.

I've reviewed several threads and can't seem to find a current (2017), real-world value for this machine. Pinside lists value at $1940-$2260 and Boston pinball shows the 2016 YTD as $2766. I'm assuming these values represent machines in better physical condition than the one I currently explained. Further, I realize much of the price of this machine is likely the pure collectable nature that is possesses and ultimately the value is what someone is willing to pay for it, hence the reason for my support request.

Being a noob, I've read that most first-time pinball buyers overpay. I'm looking to avoid the trap and fend off an impulse buy. Everyone on Pinside seems extremely helpful so I'm hoping for a little guidance from the collective wealth of knowledge! Thanks in advance!

#2 1 year ago

As a noob, be prepared to pay $2000-3000 for a KISS machine in nice shape that's going to be reliable.

I'd resist the urge to get a ratty project for $1500 or so, which is gonna be on your lower end of KISS prices.

The one you describe...who the hell knows? Does it have original boards? Have any connectors been replaced? Where is this game, CL? A retail store? Ebay?

Just because it "works" right now doesn't mean it'll work when you get it home. And why do you include so much stuff in your post about how shitty KISS is?

it's a fun game. You aren't gonna win any points here by explaining what you are buying and why...there are people here who like Street Fighter II for Pete's sake.

#3 1 year ago

Thanks for the info Crazy Levi.

As far as I can tell and have been told, everything is original and nothing looks to have been replaced. The machine was acquired as part of an estate purchase by a local liquidator that contained other old/vintage machines and has been owned by the same person for 30 years or so. For being nearly 40 years old it's in good shape and by far isn't in ratty condition.

#4 1 year ago

$2K to 3K+ depends on the local market and condition. I'd say at least 2K for KISS. Game has a lot of sentimental value to people and for KISS collectors it's a must have.

#5 1 year ago

When you deal with Estate Sales or Liquidators, you're not going to get a full description of the game. They are looking to get rid of stuff, lots of stuff... lots of different stuff. They usually have little technical aptitude, or if they do it's not in the world of pinball. Are you looking at this online and is how you're gauging the condition, or have you seen this in person and perhaps even played it?

IMO it's quite hard to put a price on an old pin you haven't played. Newer games it's easier because less time has elapsed for things to go wrong. Bally Kiss is harder to pin a price because it's worth more than most of the games of that era. CL is correct above that you're probably close to $3K for a good one... but if you're only looking at some photos online, you probably should see it in person with some prices in mind given certain things that may not have been seen in the pictures. They may be basing their price because "that's what they go for on eBay" which is the worst reasoning in the entire hobby.

Also check for inserts cupping (concave) which may be leading to the wear around the Kiss inserts in the middle of the Playfield. It may not be a major thing at first but then when you play it and the ball isn't rolling in straight lines, you'll go crazy. Also if it's been in the same place not serviced for 30 years, you are absolutely doing a full teardown to get this thing playable again.

Good luck with the search. If it's a full functioning, well playing game with some minor cosmetic issues, you probably won't get it for less than $3K, but I'd try to start at $1800-$2000 and see how close you can keep it to that number.

#6 1 year ago

Thanks for the responses, you guys are great! I haven't seen the machine in person yet but wanted to arm myself with as much knowledge as possible before I do. They're asking $2800 for it and I've already said no to that, they called me today and want to negotiate so maybe I'll toss out a number contingent upon inspection and see what they say. Thanks again!

#7 1 year ago

You might be the first person to ever set a real-world value on a KISS pin.

#8 1 year ago

Even if you agree to a price, don't send them a nickel until you inspect in person. Get that thing turned on and flipping (assuming it can do both, and if not, zeros should start to fall off your price). Go over the PF real close, including underneath. Check out the boards to the best of your ability. These are complex items with many things that can/will go wrong. Simple fixes (coils, replacing rubbers, flipper mechs) can be fixed by anyone with decent technical know-how, and this site will walk you through all of those things. But some things (garbage playfields, shot boards) don't sound like how you want to kickstart your pinball hobby.

#9 1 year ago

I paid 1000 for mine about 5 yrs ago. Was likely in better shape than the one you describe. Cabinet had very little fade. Little wear around the KISS inserts in the middle of the PF, and some cupped inserts. Spend about 150 in board work and had pretty decent looking and 100% playing machine. Really not a bad pin IMO. I'm biased because I like KISS though. I'd like another some day when room permits. I wouldn't offer much, if any over 2k on this one with the info you shared....just my .02

#10 1 year ago

Playfield wear and cupped inserts are fairly complex to fix compared to board problems. If you inspect it and a couple displays aren't working odds are good you can have that fixed for a couple hundred $$. If you have cupped inserts or planking on the playfield that's several hundred (or a significant amount of work on your part) to either fix or swap playfields. Check the backglass too, look for flaking paint.

#11 1 year ago

Thanks again everyone, I really appreciate the insight and guidance. I had the seller send me a close-up of the playfield wear they told me about and have attached. According to them, this is the only area of wear on the playfield. If someone can give me some feedback on whether this wear is of significant concern, I'd greatly appreciate it.

PF_wear (resized).JPG

#12 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

And why do you include so much stuff in your post about how shitty KISS is?
it's a fun game. You aren't gonna win any points here by explaining what you are buying and why...

It's his very first post here. He asked a question as a noob for petes sake.

Looks little better than most kiss's from that only one picture. You need to see EVERYTHING before you give any money. Play the game first. Get more pictures and post them here.

#13 1 year ago

Thanks for the response (and defense) Travish! Didn't realize they also attached a picture of the boards... see attached.

boards (resized).JPG

#14 1 year ago

That is a pretty odd-looking wear pattern around the inserts, generally looks strange to me. Does this game have one of the weird plastic playfields?

#15 1 year ago

I don't know, trying to coordinate with the seller to look at it tomorrow. Just read a thread after you mentioned the plastic playfield and I suppose it's possible it is as it seems Bally "experimented" and KISS and Playboy machines have been seen with them.

#16 1 year ago
Quoted from Cherga:

Thanks again everyone, I really appreciate the insight and guidance. I had the seller send me a close-up of the playfield wear they told me about and have attached. According to them, this is the only area of wear on the playfield. If someone can give me some feedback on whether this wear is of significant concern, I'd greatly appreciate it.

That's typical wear for a KISS playfield. Nothing unusual about it. It is a standard wood playfield..

#17 1 year ago

If everything is original this thing is a ticking time bomb. I wouldn't go a penny over $2000. Hopefully you're handy and don't mind board repair/rebuilding, troubleshooting etc. Your first pin could be a great experience or a learning nightmare. Good luck!

#18 1 year ago

Thanks for all the help everyone. I got the seller down from 2800 to 1500 and not a penny less pending inspection and playability testing. I am checking it out tomorrow and had one more question... do these machines display errors on the back glass if something is wrong? Is there anything specific to look for when powering up?

#19 1 year ago

Print this out and bring with you. Tests you can run are on Page 13.
http://mirror2.ipdb.org/files/1386/Bally_1979_Kiss_Manual.pdf

#20 1 year ago
Quoted from Bohdi:

That's typical wear for a KISS playfield. Nothing unusual about it. It is a standard wood playfield..

Dunno- the edges of the wear areas look weird to me. Maybe someone peeled off some of the paint with a finger or stopped playing it after knocking off that chunk over the bottom S. Or the paint has completely separated from the playfield and is just floating there. Whatever it is, a chip that deep with zero wear on the new edge is just kind of strange.

In any case if the inserts are cracking out and cupped (which they look to be) it's a probably wood playfield as Bohdi said.

#21 1 year ago

Yoko, thanks for the manual, will be helpful to bring with me.

#22 1 year ago
Quoted from Cherga:

Thanks for the responses, you guys are great! I haven't seen the machine in person yet but wanted to arm myself with as much knowledge as possible before I do. They're asking $2800 for it and I've already said no to that, they called me today and want to negotiate so maybe I'll toss out a number contingent upon inspection and see what they say. Thanks again!

Don't worry about cupped inserts - very common and an easy fix with some super thin super glue.

The inserts look good and that's not serious wear for a KISS.

I would check also the displays - any dim displays or displays with malformed numbers or bright burn spots will need to be replaced and they aren't cheap (around $60 each for LED). On an old Bally like this I usually expect at least 2-3 to need replacement.

Still, I wouldn't pay serious money for this game. It's been sitting around for decades and whether or not it "works" right now it needs work. Might be hard to let the dream go but this one would top out at around $1500 for me. Totally up to you though if you want a kiss, you want a kiss! Certainly worth acquiring as it is not ratty. Boards look decent too.

#23 1 year ago

Thanks CL. 1500 is the seller's bottom line pending my inspection. If everything matches his description coupled with the tests/suggestions from those in the thread, I'll likely go for it.

#24 1 year ago
Quoted from Cherga:

Thanks CL. 1500 is the seller's bottom line pending my inspection. If everything matches his description coupled with the tests/suggestions from those in the thread, I'll likely go for it.

You could do worse!

#25 1 year ago
Quoted from Cherga:

1500 is the seller's bottom line pending my inspection.

Not bad for this title.

#26 1 year ago

If you are able to play a game on it, the displays work, and the backglass looks decent, I say go for it. No need to stick around and test every little thing. That can be annoying for the seller. That's a good price for a working KISS

#27 1 year ago

As long as it plays I would buy it in a heart beat. Good price for the condition. And I wouldn't wait around or get nit-picky. This would be sold in a day if others knew about it. I can also guess now that you posted it was on CL there will be several people trying to find it.

#28 1 year ago

For this price, if it works or not, buy it!

#29 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Don't worry about cupped inserts - very common and an easy fix with some super thin super glue.
The inserts look good and that's not serious wear for a KISS.
I would check also the displays - any dim displays or displays with malformed numbers or bright burn spots will need to be replaced and they aren't cheap (around $60 each for LED). On an old Bally like this I usually expect at least 2-3 to need replacement.
Still, I wouldn't pay serious money for this game. It's been sitting around for decades and whether or not it "works" right now it needs work. Might be hard to let the dream go but this one would top out at around $1500 for me. Totally up to you though if you want a kiss, you want a kiss! Certainly worth acquiring as it is not ratty. Boards look decent too.

Please, show us any other Kiss machines that you are buying for $1500.

#30 1 year ago
Quoted from arcademojo:

As long as it plays I would buy it in a heart beat. Good price for the condition. And I wouldn't wait around or get nit-picky. This would be sold in a day if others knew about it. I can also guess now that you posted it was on CL there will be several people trying to find it.

Yup, you're going to need to hurry up and grab this now before someone else does. Time is of the essence at this point. People who have seen this thread are now looking for it. If it works, buy it.

#31 1 year ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

Please, show us any other Kiss machines that you are buying for $1500.

I wish people would give this shit a rest. It's in EVERY price check thread.

I've bought several for less than that, though I can't "show" them to you as they are long gone. But that's besides the point.

I said I would likely pay about $1500 max for this game. I didn't say I know where 10 of them are available for that price. I didn't say HE Shouldn't pay more. I said what *I* would pay for it.

So please, stow the tired "I'll take 10 at that price!" routine - it's old.

#32 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

I wish people would give this shit a rest. It's in EVERY price check thread.
I've bought several for less than that, though I can't "show" them to you as they are long gone. But that's besides the point.
I said I would likely pay about $1500 max for this game. I didn't say I know where 10 of them are available for that price. I didn't say HE Shouldn't pay more. I said what *I* would pay for it.
So please, stow the tired "I'll take 10 at that price!" routine - it's old.

If they are long gone, then those prices were long ago!

#33 1 year ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

If they are long gone, then those prices were long ago!

Please re-read my previous post.

#34 1 year ago
Quoted from pinlink:

Yup, you're going to need to hurry up and grab this now before someone else does. Time is of the essence at this point. People who have seen this thread are now looking for it. If it works, buy it.

Thank you! That's what I was trying to say but wanted to be polite. It was a dumbass newbie move of posting where he seen the game. Too many flippers in this hobby that would buy the game right out from under you without giving it a second thought.
To the op:::::: (person that posted this thread)
Get off your ass and go get the game!!!!!! If there is a problem with it just start a tech thread here and we will help.

#35 1 year ago

I think you guys are really overestimating the MAD RUSH of crazed rabid pinheads and flippers that would be trampling each other and driving over their own mothers to snag a deal on a $1500 (at best) deal on a random KISS. Like, seriously.

It's 70s KISS. There's a million of them. They aren't that outrageously priced. Relax.

(but yes, it's wise to keep deal details to yourself around here before the game is in the van!)

#36 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

I think you guys are really overestimating the MAD RUSH of crazed rabid pinheads and flippers that would be trampling each other and driving over their own mothers to snag a deal on a $1500 (at best) deal on a random KISS. Like, seriously.
It's 70s KISS. There's a million of them. They aren't that outrageously priced. Relax.
(but yes, it's wise to keep deal details to yourself around here before the game is in the van!)

I agree with you, Levi. I don't think there will be a MAD RUSH to snag this game. But as you and I both know, it only takes one. And I'm sure there is at least one.

#37 1 year ago

Buy this for sure at 1500$ after it's cleaned up it'll be worth 2k as long as the glass is perfect. Sold a pretty ratty kiss for 1800 at ohio show last year (perfect glass). And have seen several sell around there in unshopped condition. Those inserts arent too bad. I would get a playfield protector to put on after you clean the field real nice and play away.
https://www.playfield-protectors.com/Home/Details/1xAkH4grK0q45_93sjAcng?catgoryid=22&name=Playfield%20Protector%20Kiss%20%7C%201979

These bally's have the cheapest and easiest boards to swap out so dont let that discourage you, keep the originals even if you pull one out to swap. I cant tell you how many junk bally's we've owned and just tossed in a new ultimate and they fired right up. Sometimes you have to recap the soundboard or replace the pots but that is novice board work. Most everything is on these except the mpu which is 150$ from barakandl

#38 1 year ago

Wow, things really blew up! Nevertheless, it's a done deal. Thanks for everyone's support and guidance. It's been quite a learning experience for me. Once I get it home and give it a full run-through, I'll follow up with any tech needs and in the unlikely event I landed a gem, I'll post some pictures. Thanks again everyone!

#39 1 year ago
Quoted from Cherga:

Wow, things really blew up! Nevertheless, it's a done deal. Thanks for everyone's support and guidance. It's been quite a learning experience for me. Once I get it home and give it a full run-through, I'll follow up with any tech needs and in the unlikely event I landed a gem, I'll post some pictures. Thanks again everyone!

Congrats dude!

And hey VdoJaq, I found a $1500 KISS to show you!

#40 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

I think you guys are really overestimating the MAD RUSH of crazed rabid pinheads and flippers that would be trampling each other and driving over their own mothers to snag a deal on a $1500 (at best) deal on a random KISS. Like, seriously.
It's 70s KISS. There's a million of them. They aren't that outrageously priced. Relax.
(but yes, it's wise to keep deal details to yourself around here before the game is in the van!)

See, here is where I think you are mistaken. If that game were put up in the Chicago area on CL for $1500, it would have been a mad bum rush for it. It probably would have sold for higher. An yes, a few would have driven over their mothers for it.

Because YOU don't like the game or the band, it doesn't make the value any less.

#41 1 year ago
Quoted from vdojaq:

See, here is where I think you are mistaken. If that game were put up in the Chicago area on CL for $1500, it would have been a mad bum rush for it. It probably would have sold for higher. An yes, a few would have driven over their mothers for it.
Because YOU don't like the game or the band, it doesn't make the value any less.

I DO like the game!!!

Were do you come up with this shit?

And I "like" the band I'm just not a flaming KISStard - like most sane people.

#42 1 year ago

Hmm, honest question. Do you want a Kiss pinball machine because Kiss is a good band or do you want a Kiss pinball machine because it's a good pinball machine?

Personally, I don't believe either to be true. Why don't new buyers ever look for good machines like Paragon or Harlem Globetrotters?

#43 1 year ago
Quoted from snyper2099:

Hmm, honest question. Do you want a Kiss pinball machine because Kiss is a good band or do you want a Kiss pinball machine because it's a good pinball machine?
Personally, I don't believe either to be true. Why don't new buyers look for good machines like Paragon?

KISS is WAY better than garbage like Paragon. It's a perfectly good late 70s Bally game. The fantastic art seals it for many people.

Paragon - like most widebodies - sucks.

#44 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

I DO like the game!!!
Were do you come up with this shit?
And I "like" the band I'm just not a flaming KISStard - like most sane people.

That's on me then....I though you hated them and the machines

#45 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

KISS is WAY better than garbage like Paragon. It's a perfectly good late 70s Bally game. The fantastic art seals it for many people.
Paragon - like most widebodies - sucks.

I am picking up the ultimate widebody....a Gottlieb Circus. Always wanted one of these.

#46 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Paragon - like most widebodies - sucks.

Yeah. Ok. Kiss pinball art is good and sells the game and they were also a great band. Just keep saying it and it will become true!

#47 1 year ago
Quoted from snyper2099:

Yeah. Ok. Kiss pinball art is good and sells the game and they were also a great band. Just keep saying it and it will be true!

Wait, I thought I hated KISS?

You enjoy Paragon and it's huge outlanes and pop bumper pit of death that were shoehorned in to justify making the game 6 inches wider than it needs to be - I'll just enjoy some good old fashioned drop targets, spinners, speed, and ballsave gate on an kickass Bally KISS. YEAH!

#48 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Wait, I thought I hated KISS?
You enjoy Paragon and it's huge outlanes and pit of death that were shoehorned into justify making the game 6 inches wider than it needs to be - I'll just enjoy some good old fashioned drop targets, spinners, speed, and ballsave gate on an kickass Bally KISS. YEAH!

Learn how to play better and you won't need the ball save gate! JK
Love my Paragon but hated it for years because of that pit of doom.

#49 1 year ago
Quoted from Cherga:

Wow, things really blew up! Nevertheless, it's a done deal. Thanks for everyone's support and guidance. It's been quite a learning experience for me. Once I get it home and give it a full run-through, I'll follow up with any tech needs and in the unlikely event I landed a gem, I'll post some pictures. Thanks again everyone!

Congrats, man! Post some pics when you get the chance!

#50 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

KISS is WAY better than garbage like Paragon. It's a perfectly good late 70s Bally game. The fantastic art seals it for many people.
Paragon - like most widebodies - sucks.

Ooooooooooffffff!

Paragon ... one of the best pins ever made!

All kneel down and praise it!

Or be cast into the Valley of Demons.

rd

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