(Topic ID: 298711)

1976 Chicago Coin Cinema Same Player shoots again issue.

By CarlH

9 months ago



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  • 9 posts
  • 2 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 8 months ago by CarlH
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Cinema High Score (resized).jpg

#1 9 months ago

Hello all, I have recently purchased a 1976 CC Cinema 4 player EM game. Everything is functional so far with only the usual minor issues with EM machines. I am learning fast but still need help from the pros. The problem I am having is only with players 3 and 4. The game is set for free play. "Same Player" ball is set for 51,000, and 80,000 points. Players 1 and 2 work as advertised at those values, however players 3 and 4 pass right thru those values and don't post "Same Player". Note: all 4 of the players can receive "Same Ball" when Exiting Lit Special lanes. Can someone guide me to where the issue may be? Has anyone seen this before?

#2 9 months ago

If you change the award level does the behavior change? If so chances are that the contacts on each player's score reels that indicate which digits are showing need to be cleaned.

If the award level doesn't affect the behavior it may be that the contacts on the Player Control Unit (in red) that advance as each player plays are only working for players 1 and 2.
Cinema High Score (resized).jpg
You can jumper across the contacts on the Player Control Unit to test that theory. For example if you jumper the R-Y (red-yellow) and W-BLU (white-blue) wires together on the left side of the schematic, and the Y-W and Y-B wires together on the right side of the schematic you remove the Player Control Unit from the circuit for player 3. If doing that allows player 3 to get a high score replay you know the problem is with one of those two connections.

/Mark

#3 9 months ago

Thank you Mark for you suggestion. It will take me several days to get around to checking this out but I will give you the answer when I do.

#4 9 months ago

Hello All and MarkG,
I have tried both of your troubleshooting suggestions above and the results are still the same. No "Same Player Shoots Again" light on players 3 & 4 when high scores are achieved. (1) Lowered the values, and (2) Jumper the Player control at specified wires for player 3 and then player 4. Had no effect. Got to be something between player 3 or 4 output to which ever relay controls the light. Again All works as advertised for Players 1 & 2 and All 4 players get extra ball on lit exit lanes. Could still use some advice.

#5 9 months ago

Suppose you were to jumper around different parts of the circuit? For example if you jumpered from the red-yellow wire (common to all four players) on the left side of the schematic above, to the yellow-black wire (also common to all four players) on the right side of the schematic you should get an extra ball any time the 1000-9000 relay fires for any player. If you jumper instead from red-yellow on the left to yellow-white on the right, you should get an extra ball any time the 1000-9000 relay fires and player 3 is up. Moving the jumpers around and observing what happens should offer clues to where the issue is.

#6 8 months ago

Hello all and MarkG,
I have tried your suggestion above and I have posted the result details below. It appears to work when bypassed directly at every 1,000 points. Did each individually as well. I did continuity checks on the listed wires from PCU thru each Drum (Drum set to 0) and found no issues. I did find a mechanical issue with 3rd player 10,000 drum and corrected the loose armature. But that did not change anything after fixing. Still the same. On to the next suggestion.

 Jumpered red-yellow at PCU to yellow-black at PCU.
o Results= Each of the 4 players lit the same player light when they hit 1000 points. (Good)
 Jumpered red-yellow at PCU to each payer PCU wire individually
o Results= To 3rd player yellow-white, Yes, it worked for 3rd player only and no others (Good)
o Results= To 4th player green-white, Yes, it worked for 4th player only and no others (Good)
o Results= To 2nd player orange-white, Yes, it worked for 2nd player only and no others (Good)
o Results= To 1st player maroon-red, Yes, it worked for 1st player only and no others (Good)
 Checked Continuity between PCU and Score Adjust plug wires
o All 4 were good to plug and thru plug to outgoing wires.
 Checked continuity between Score adjust plug outgoing wires to each player 10,000 Drum including thru the drum to out going wire. (Note all 10,000 drums indicating 0)
o Player 1 PCU maroon-red to score adjust in, score adjust out white-red to 10,000 drum white-red, 10,000 drum white-red thru drum out to blue-orange. (no issues)
o Player 2 PCU orange-white to score adjust in, score adjust out orange-blue, to 10,000 drum orange-blue, 10,000 drum orange-blue thru drum out to blue-white. (no issues)
o Player 3 PCU yellow-white to score adjust in, score adjust out green-blue to 10,000 drum green-blue, 10,000 drum green-blue thru drum out to blue-white. (no issues)
o Player 4 PCU green-white to score adjust in, score adjust out white-green to 10,000 drum white-green, 10,000 drum white-green thru drum out to blue-brown. (no issues)

#7 8 months ago

Your jumper tests tell you that the Player Control Unit connections on the right side of the schematic are working. Good. But why did you switch to continuity tests after that? Continuity by itself only tells you that the meter sees a path between the probes. In many cases you can't reliably know which path or paths the meter sees without a lot more circuit analysis. If you want to make measurements with the power off measure resistance, not continuity. (Much more elsewhere in the forum.)

I'd stick with the jumper tests. In fact stick with player 3 to start and gradually decrease the amount of circuit you bypass with the jumper to see if you can isolate what part of the circuit isn't working.

#8 8 months ago

Thanks for hanging with me. I don't know why I went that way just thought I would get lucky and find a broken wire. I'm still a rookie when it comes to this stuff. I will go back to jumpering to see if I can isolate. Reading the schematic gives me a headache and I have trouble understanding what the expected reaction should be to what is jumpered. I was able to follow your instructions perfectly. Done working on it for now. Will try again next weekend when I get time. I will keep you posted and if you can think of something just let me know.

#9 8 months ago

Problem has been fixed. There were two issues found.
1) found broken wire on Player 3 1000s unit going to player 4 1000s unit causing the 4th player issue.
2) found small tab not making contact with 1000s unit PC board on Player 3 (same circuit) causing Player 3 issue.
Working 100% now.

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