(Topic ID: 206087)
Algonquin, IL
Fixed! The "Shot control" relay was getting stuck. I took it apart cleaned it up and put it back together again and it works 100% now!
Aaaand she's for sale!
Translite received! Used posterprintshop.com, extremely satisfied with the service and product! The translite looks GREAT!
Yesterday I also called Steve Young and placed my first order. Hopefully ordered all the missing parts I need to get this going. The stepper unit is missing the springs which has made troubleshooting very difficult thus far.
IMG_20190807_195304 (resized).jpgQuoted from dudah:Gun is stained and cleared, painted the butt plate and screws. Let everything dry for 3 days.[quoted image][quoted image]
Is that a Remington?
Quoted from edward472:Is that a Remington?
Yes. They used surplus Remington stocks from a wide variety of models in the 60's. The buttplate also says "Remington". I know that they came from the factory with "Midway" buttplates but in the 3 rifle games I've gotten none of them had one. I've also been unable to source one.
Quoted from dudah:Yes. They used surplus Remington stocks from a wide variety of models in the 60's. The buttplate also says "Remington". I know that they came from the factory with "Midway" buttplates but in the 3 rifle games I've gotten none of them had one. I've also been unable to source one.
Good to know. Thanks. I maybe needing a new stock for my new project game and was wondering what brand they used.
Quoted from edward472:Good to know. Thanks. I maybe needing a new stock for my new project game and was wondering what brand they used.
Good luck! The original ones are impossible to find. I saw a video on the Facebook EM rifle page where a guy was machining out the center of another rifle stock to make it fit.
Good news! Spent some time servicing the reel assembly.
Freed up two stuck discs that are now working great, and consequently, so does the rest of the game!
I feel much more confident in my knowledge of the operation of the game (even without the schematic), I still have to hook up some more wiring (coin door, recoil mech) but feel game operation is nearly there.
Took a look at the gun and will need to make a little part to ensure it mounts well.
I need to get back to the hackerspace to cut out the translite plastic and now 3D print this rifle part.
After that it's just a little more reassembly, then finish up getting it working!
I feel good that I'm near the end, it's VERY frustrating working on multiple projects at a time as each one only makes little progress.
This certainly has been a challenge on it's own!
I've been avoiding figuring out the hardware to mount the rifle.
I was give a few random screws which was the same size as the thread on the rifle but certainly needed some more.
I had most, but still had to do a Home Depot run.
I mis-measured one bolt and the trigger switch needs to be adjusted, but the rifle is very secure.
I also realized that I was missing a spring on the trigger.
Got this one and snipped off 1/3 of it and squeezed it in the cavity in the back of the gun.
IMG_20190815_203926 (resized).jpgIMG_20190815_204518 (resized).jpg
I also got a new eyehook for the rifle chain.
Drilled a hole at the end of the barrel and tapped it, screwed in the chain.
Easily removable if you need to.
Replaced the bad/empty bulbs and looks great!
Also replaced the black light which is now turning on!
I mocked up the translite and also looks great!
Not much left...
MVIMG_20190815_211833 (resized).jpgIMG_20190815_211916 (resized).jpgIMG_20190815_211853 (resized).jpg
Looking good! Question... did you do anything to the barrel, I know you stripped and re-stained the stock but did you re-blue or re-paint any of the barrels. On my Captn Kid, the barrel looks to be blued and I was gonna use Perma Blue on it and re-stain the stock.
Quoted from smohr:Looking good! Question... did you do anything to the barrel, I know you stripped and re-stained the stock but did you re-blue or re-paint any of the barrels. On my Captn Kid, the barrel looks to be blued and I was gonna use Perma Blue on it and re-stain the stock.
Thanks!
I painted this one with a gloss black rattle can and it turned out great.
Once I have some more downtime I'm looking to get back to my local hackerspace and learn to sandblast/powdercoat for my Captain Kid.
I noticed earlier that the wire for the trigger leaf switch was erratic, maybe a broken conductor.
Took it out and noticed the solder tab had broken off! The previous owner had a small metal bracket shorted out on what was left of the leaf!
It also had the coldest nastiest solder joint ever.
Replaced both!
IMG_20190822_211301 (resized).jpgIMG_20190822_211255 (resized).jpg
Putzed around with the aiming for a bit, got it real figured out now.
Had to make some adjustments on the rifle a bit and then dial it in on the bakelite.
It was pretty easy to do alone - first I aim at a static target, I hold the rifle with my left hand, then adjust inside with my right hand to get it to line up on the bakelite.
IMG_20190822_220812 (resized).jpg
Played a bunch of games and it appears to be working 98%.
Next step is to reinstall the motor I serviced!
Finished putzing around with the motor!
One of the brush holders cracked so I had to harvest one out of the eBay motor
IMG_20190824_152429 (resized).jpg
IMG_20190824_155119 (resized).jpg
Didn't spin.
Upon inspecting the schematic, I'm missing the rheostat to control the speed.
While the holes are there, it's totally missing.
May buy another, may just throw a small resistor (faster) in there
Also gotta check if these resistors are anywhere
Capture (resized).JPG
Diving into more of the electrical tonight....
There's a few hacks. Namely, there's an extra switch on the "game over" relay that's wired into where something on the "change cycle" would be.
(comparing to photos I took from MG2)
Initially threw me off because they used cloth insulated hookup wire, it looked factory
Printed out some schematics related to the outer target motor and verified some wire/switch connections. Marked up the schematic to trace it down.
The colors on the cloth wires are VERY faded and dirty, confirmed wires I've been labeling
The outer target motor can't spin freely. I tried hooking it straight up to power and it barely rotates and takes the inner target assembly with it. Need to take the whole thing apart to clean and lube it.
I did manage to glue a broken bakelite tonight and got the aiming dialed in.
Took out the motor/target tray.
Desoldered the non-working outer target motor.
The mechanism was binding up, so took it apart.
It's actually very simple to do.
Cleaned up all the scenery, turned out very nice!
Thinking about triple thicking it, thoughts?
IMG_20190826_234127 (resized).jpgIMG_20190826_234257 (resized).jpgIMG_20190826_234307 (resized).jpgIMG_20190826_235214 (resized).jpgIMG_20190826_235228 (resized).jpgIMG_20190826_235020 (resized).jpgIMG_20190826_235234 (resized).jpg
It was clearly filthy! Wiped down the contacts with alcohol, lightly sanded lubed with SuperLube.
Lightly cleaned the contacts on the target side.
Started to reassemble...
Then disaster struck...
Upon disassembling, I noticed some metal shards coming out of the shaft from the inner targets where it meets the base outer targets.
Upon reassembling, I can't get it to go back in! The shaft won't center properly preventing a tight collar from going on.
Further examination led to a roll pin that was hit too far into the tube on the outer target base! It had been grinding down on the shaft for a while!
I tried lining the groove up with the roll pin and still can't get it.
Thoughts on how to fix?
I tried putting the flat and sharp end of a flathead in there and whacking it to no luck.
It's at least 3 inches in there. Maybe find a long dremel type circular sanding disk?
Maybe heat it up with a torch first?
The other thought is to sand down the shaft where the groove is more.
2 steps forward, 1 step backwards....
IMG_20190827_004532 (resized).jpgIMG_20190827_004543 (resized).jpgIMG_20190826_234649 (resized).jpg
After some contemplation, I decided to go out to the garage and try the roll pin again.
A series of screwdrivers, and long sockets getting whacked with the hammer I set it back just a millimeter or two - enough to get in the center shaft!
I pulled the outer target motor and it worked, but needed a little tightening and some spacers to get it just right.
I put everything back together and tested it and it worked great!!!!
Played a game and everything seems to be working!!!
The outer target motor is VERY fast! I ordered some new 10W ceramic resistors (200 ohm, 75 and 75 ohms). Very strange, but the outer target motor resistors get mounted on the inner target motor frame.
Side note - I FOUND THE SCHEMATIC
I moved about 18 months ago into my first home so it's not like I have a mess of a house.
I pride myself on being very organized so it KILLED ME that I couldn't find it.
Despite the few hours I spent turning my work area upside down, I managed to find it tucked away in my closet with some papers from my house closing.
Not sure how it ended up there, but thrilled I found it!
Dare I say I'm in the home stretch.
Things left to do:
-Minor paint touchups
-Replace the fuse block
-There's one stray wire on the target assembly. Gotta run a splice into the jones plug.
-Put a lock in the lower back door and put in some brackets to secure it
-Laser cut the new plexi for the translite
-Install a credit button in the coin reject hole. While I have the coin mech, the plate it mounts to with the coin reject button is missing. Not worth the time and effort to recreate one in my opinion as this will likely be in a home environment forever.
-Depending on the motor speed I may add back in the rheostat. I measured MG2 and it was 200 ohms.
1 week later
Quoted from CastilianFly:What liquid did you use to clean off the scenery? Just water? It turned out great.
Yes, just a lightly damp rag. Moving it regularly so I'm not dragging a dirty rag across it.
1 week later
Fuse block replaced (I ended up not using the connectors)
Resistors added to the target motor, outer targets are a much more normal speed now!
Cleaned up the wiring for the recoil solenoid - feels great!
Sorted through the parts box, wrapped up the old motor parts in case someone ever needs them
Put on the lock
Running out of things to do!
IMG_20190917_155548 (resized).jpgPainted a little stencil I made
Put in the target door brackets
Put in the target door lock
Realized I accidentally rotated the target door - re-drilled the lock spot and patched the incorrect one
Put the service panel lock on
Took a paint brush and touched up a little purple, I need to do the same for the base color
It's not perfect but it's all tidied up!
Really all that's left is fabricate up a coin mech and cut the translite plastic/mask!
IMG_20190919_172146 (resized).jpgIMG_20190919_175920 (resized).jpgIMG_20190919_201740 (resized).jpg
3 months later
Been so busy forgot to update this thread!
Finished the game up:
Got the plexi for the translite cut and installed
Made a masking layer for the translite on my vinyl cutter
Skipped the coin mech and installed a credit button (thanks, AliBaba)
Made a backup of the schematic
Tidied everything up and vacuumed out the inside
And she's now for sale!
IMG_0575 (resized).jpgIMG_0570 (resized).jpgIMG_0577 (resized).jpgIMG_0578 (resized).jpgIMG_0582 (resized).jpgIMG_0584 (resized).jpgIMG_0585 (resized).jpgIMG_0586 (resized).jpgIMG_0569 (resized).jpg 2 weeks later
Might as well keep this going. Picked up another rough project from Spacemanratso09 this week!
53AD6746-C808-444A-9E27-C614479F4ED6 (resized).jpeg 2 weeks later
1964 Midway Rifle Champ gun arcade game how can you service the bottom side of the rifle game. Thanks
Quoted from Twventure:1964 Midway Rifle Champ gun arcade game how can you service the bottom side of the rifle game. Thanks
Looking at pictures it doesn't appear to have the side access panel.
You should be able to access everything through the coin door.
4 weeks later
After an initial inspection, I noticed a couple relays has their contact arms blown out and some ding dong put foil on there paired with some poor soldering.
I seized a game being parted out on eBay and got a few relays for parts.
This past weekend I did a bunch to get it going/make it safe:
New line cord
Replaced all fuse blocks
Replaced troublesome relays
Installing some springs on the stepper
Also glued back together the rifle that was in 3 parts. It will require some patching and sanding to make it decent.
Harvested a butt plate/screws off another parts rifle I have.
I have a barrel powder coated and ready to go.
Plugging in the game, it starts right away despite the game over relay being locked in.
Inner target motor is spinning all the time, shot control relay is locked on.
Someone shorted out the trigger switch wiring for some reason. The jones plug that the rifle plugs into is all hacked up.
Still a long way to go...
pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png
pasted_image (resized).pngDudah I enjoy reading your posts and watching your videos for Monster Gun. They are very helpful as I start to figure out the issues with my Monster Gun. Mine starts up slowly and resets to 000 and then I can shoot once, but then it takes about 15 seconds before it allows me to shoot again. Also the large wheel back targets are not moving so will probably remove the RAE motor to check it out. (First will check the relays and if power getting to the motor) My Captain Kid is mostly working now except the gun recoil and the Flag 2 going up is working intermittently. Hope to check it out this weekend.
Quoted from Javelinjohn:Dudah I enjoy reading your posts and watching your videos for Monster Gun. They are very helpful as I start to figure out the issues with my Monster Gun. Mine starts up slowly and resets to 000 and then I can shoot once, but then it takes about 15 seconds before it allows me to shoot again. Also the large wheel back targets are not moving so will probably remove the RAE motor to check it out. (First will check the relays and if power getting to the motor) My Captain Kid is mostly working now except the gun recoil and the Flag 2 going up is working intermittently. Hope to check it out this weekend.
You should DEFINITELY remove the RAE motor. I just inspected mine on MG3 yesterday and it was all seized up, I'm very lucky it didn't burn out.
Took it apart (taking lots of pictures), removed the grease with q-tips, then cleaned it out with brake cleaner. The old grease was fairly hard! I was able to scrape it loose with a toothpick.
The motor was spinning, but the gearbox was seized up.
It should move fairly easily in both directions.
I had to put a couple drops of 3-in-1 oil on the top/bottom end of the vertical shaft on the housing and let those penetrate to loosen it up.
Also, one end cap on the side of the gearbox has an adjustment screw to calibrate the amount of horizontal play in the horizontal worm gear.
I had to tighten mine up a bit.
Filled the gearbox with SuperLube and it works great now!
You can see the corrosion on the vertical shaft here DSCN5233 (resized).JPG
I'll add one more dumb thing about this motor - if you look at the schematic, there's always power on it. They have "warming resistors" to keep power on the motor (even during game over) so it can spin up faster than at a cold start. It's amazing that these motors survive this condition!
More questions for Dudah. I took my motor drive apart and there was the blob! Yes it was the same scary black grease looking up at me that you have shown in a few posts. Did clean it all out but I noticed when I turn the large gear by hand it only seems to want to go one way. Does not have any grease in it at the moment but did buy some Super Lube the other day. I went to Eurton electric but no luck with brush # 296. I see others on Ebay and more at http://graphitestore.com. Will need to try to measure the hole when I take the motor apart unless you know the measurements. One side seems to have all the springs (photo attached) but the other side only has 1 spring and no sign of a brush. Also I did take the gun stock off just to see what is up there! I see one large screw, is that where the switch is located?
IMG_4721 (resized).JPGIMG_4728 (resized).JPGIMG_4742 (resized).JPGIMG_4732 (resized).JPGQuoted from Javelinjohn:More questions for Dudah. I took my motor drive apart and there was the blob! Yes it was the same scary black grease looking up at me that you have shown in a few posts. Did clean it all out but I noticed when I turn the large gear by hand it only seems to want to go one way. Does not have any grease in it at the moment but did buy some Super Lube the other day. I went to Eurton electric but no luck with brush # 296. I see others on Ebay and more at http://graphitestore.com. Will need to try to measure the hole when I take the motor apart unless you know the measurements. One side seems to have all the springs (photo attached) but the other side only has 1 spring and no sign of a brush. Also I did take the gun stock off just to see what is up there! I see one large screw, is that where the switch is located?[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
Very nice!!!
When I was doing the motor at the beginning of this thread I got a roll pin removal kit and disassembled the gearbox assembly to clean and relube it even better.
Check to make sure the vertical shaft (with the gear attached) isn't binding in the housing, I squirted some oil in there to loosen it up.
I'm pretty sure the brushes are a universal part. They have a slight curve in the brush, make sure when you insert it the curve bends around the shaft. Be sure the motor is spinning freely before reattaching the gearbox.
1 week later
Quoted from Javelinjohn:More questions for Dudah. I took my motor drive apart and there was the blob! Yes it was the same scary black grease looking up at me that you have shown in a few posts. Did clean it all out but I noticed when I turn the large gear by hand it only seems to want to go one way. Does not have any grease in it at the moment but did buy some Super Lube the other day. I went to Eurton electric but no luck with brush # 296. I see others on Ebay and more at http://graphitestore.com. Will need to try to measure the hole when I take the motor apart unless you know the measurements. One side seems to have all the springs (photo attached) but the other side only has 1 spring and no sign of a brush. Also I did take the gun stock off just to see what is up there! I see one large screw, is that where the switch is located?[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
if you want more gear box inspiration, those pictures reminds me of this vide:
2 weeks later
Dudah
Midway collector. I don’t know how I got so attached to them. Have a SAMI, Sea Raider, Jokerball, Cobra Shuffle Alley. Had a Panzer but sold it to a friend of mine that has a collection.
Currently restoring my basket case ground up restoration HH for the family arcade which I should have wrapped up in a couple weeks.
Looking for an MG. Definitely interested in adding one to my collection.
Enjoying watching you walk through your restoration process of MG’s.
Keep up the great work!
OHEMIO
1 week later
1 year later
Hello, I was that ding dong that put the foil on the relays. LOL I was 11 years old when I did that. My dad had this machine ever since before I was born. I was supposed to go back to Saint Louis and get it out of my dad's warehouse in 2019, but we all know how busy life can get. I am currently working on one with my 11 year old son, but the case is extremely rotted out with termite/ water damage. I was researching it and came across this thread. Do you by any chance still have this machine and is it for sale?
Reply
Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.
Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!
Donate to PinsideGreat to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!
