You will need to post the schematic to have any chance of figuring this out. Pinball database doesn’t offer it.

If your machine is similar to 1957 deluxe baseball, then check the make/break switch on the motor relay. It controls sending power to the pitch push button switch when the relay is not energized. Clean and adjust switch if needed.

1st question: Is your game resetting the bank completely. In your video I can’t be sure?

If it is the 2nd question is how does your bat get energized before the pitch motor rotates and fires a ball? Check the other make break switch on the pitching cam as both switches appear powered ie closed before the make break cam switch changes.

We can get to question 3 that you are asking once we clarify questions 1&2. We will for your question probably need a 5’ wire and two croc clips next.

Since your machine has 2 pitch buttons, the wiring is different from the schematic I was looking at. Please post your schematic so the proper circuit can be troubleshooted.

until I get a chance to tidy it up and send to ipdb, a wip schem from valerie and richard conger via the pacific pinball museum is available at https://bingo.cdyn.com/ppm/short-stop/

The pic of the bank shows that the 2nd relay shows the switching arm is moved to the right. Which might hinder correct operation. Correct problem and retry.

The man running unit cam 3 index or home position has a make/break switch that transfers power from the pitching circuit to the bat relay hold circuit. It seems like this switch isn’t releasing the bat relay hold circuit and isn’t changing state to power the pitching circuit.
Clean and adjust switch if needed.

I should have said cam C instead of cam 3.

Part of the fun working on pitch and bats is unplugging and removing the man running unit for inspection. Cam switch operation is important for circuits to work correctly. Clean and check all cam and man on base switches. Check man on base load coil arm for proper operation. Reinstall unit after completed inspection.

I updated the schem in the url above and sent it to ipdb.org. The file will disappear from the bingo site eventually after it goes live on ipdb.

about your issue ... it's not obvious from the schem how the bat solenoid is powered. There's a bat relay switch, a bat switch and a bat EOS (end of stroke) switch. Typically an EOS switch is on the solenoid unit and detects when the plunger pulls in, but maybe in this case it's on the bat lever mechanism? Got a picture of the bat lever showing wires/switches on it?

in any case, the pitching issue is more straightforward. For the pitch motor to turn on, the pitcher relay needs to power. There's a few switches in the circuit. Got a voltmeter?

the circuit is below.

assuming the pitcher relay coil is ok, a quick check is manually close the pitcher relay. It should hold itself closed until the pitcher unit has spun around enough to open the "1" switch in the orange highlighted circuit.

If that works, then the orange circuit is ok and your problem is an open switch along the yellow highlight path.

If it doesn't work, then one of the two switches below the yellow highlight joint is open or the switch at F17 (not shown) is open when it shouldn't be ... or the pitcher relay coil is bad (you can touch a jumper from yellow wire 30 to the red/white wire on the pitcher relay coil to see if the coil fires).

note any cam symbol with a C in it is a switch on the pitcher unit. B is the running man unit and A is the control/relay cam unit. I think dave oopsed that and you don't need to look at the running man unit (yet).

if you have a voltmeter, you can attached one probe to the black wire on any handy 50V coil. Other probe you can poke anywhere along the orange/yellow highlighted path below the slow pitch switch and you should measure 50VAC.

ideally you jumper or hold closed the slow pitch switch and probe looking for someplace the voltage drops way below 50V. Using this approach will find a a cruddy switch in addition to an open one.
pitch (resized).png

oh, and note the schem is for game 203. ipdb says deluxe is game 205, but their description says deluxe has match and replays ... which the 203 schem has. Does your schem say 205 on it?

What I thought was mr was actually mk next to the switch symbol.

if you're bored while plodding through the pitching stuff, do you have a manual for the game or a piece of paper detailing the bat relay?

assuming the relay mounted at the charcoaled wood is the bat relay, it looks like the 3rd switch (top/furthest from frame) is upside down. It should be a normally open switch, and that would explain why your bat is working when you haven't pitched yet. Was that switch stack or entire relay replaced to your knowledge?

if you're really bored and figure out where the "strike switch" is, please post a pic of that. It may be a switch on the pitcher unit, but the blades should have yellow wire 30 and green/brown wire 46-1 on the blades and I don't see that combo in your posted pics.

just to make sure, the switch I mean is the bottom one in the picture ... it's the top switch in the stack, but the relay is appears upside down when the playfield is tilted up against the head.

that switch is currently closed when the relay is unpowered, right? If you stick paper between the contacts, the bat should no longer work.

that's not good ... either the deluxe game isn't wired like the schematic I have, or there's a wiring problem.

on the schematic you have, does it say 205 short stop or 203 short stop?

the test was just turn on the game, reset it, and close the bat switch on the rail. No pitch buttons, right?

assuming the game is wired like the 203 schematic, the 120V bat coil should not be able to power until the bat relay powers, and closing the bat switch shouldn't do that.

I think the bat relay powers when the "strike switch" closes, but I don't know where that switch is. I assume closes after the pitcher relay powers.

sanity check, the wire colors on bat relay switch 3 are yellow/red and green/red. You'll have to dig back into the harness a little to see the unfaded wire colors. Red is a particularly troublesome color ... sometimes it's fine, other times it's greyish/white.

switch 1 on the bat relay is the hold switch, but it won't hold if the pitcher motor is not running AND the pitcher relay is powered.

if you reset the game and manually close the bat relay, it should hold itself closed. If it doesn't, either switch 1 on the bat relay isn't closing or switch 3 on the pitcher relay isn't closed when the pitcher relay isn't energized (yellow and black/brown wires).

in case you aren't familiar with switch adjust, see http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index2.htm#clean

can ya post a pic of the connector plugs ... especially the one connecting the rail to the game. One explanation for the bat and pitch button behavior is that plug is in wrong somehow ... the wire colors should match between the plug and socket when the plug is installed.

you want the switch the red arrow is pointing at to close when the cam follower is around 1/2-2/3 out of the notch. That is the index carryover switch at schem F26 ... keeps the motor turned on until the follower falls in a notch. The gap looks pretty big currently, so bend the short blade down closer to the long one.
ss_pitch (resized).jpg

to get the motor running long enough for the carryover switch to take over, you need switch 1 on the pitcher relay or switch 2 on the fast pitch relay to be closed AND another cam switch with red arrow below closed.

if the pitcher motor just burps for fast and slow pitches, then it's more likely the switch below is just cruddy or not adjusted well. With power off, turn the pitch cams so the follower falls in a notch and make sure the long blade stays against the follower. Bend at the orange arrow if necessary - this is one of the exceptions to "never bend the long blade" comment that gets tossed around. You may also need to bend the leftmost blade that has no wire attached ... it's just there for the nylon lifter on the long blade to ride on.

once you have the long blade mashed against the follower in the notch, adjust the right blade for a reasonable switch gap and make sure when turning the cam until the follower is out of the notch you get good switch overtravel.

the switch itself looks oily, which is not good. Clean with alcohol or whatever to get the grease off the contacts.

as a test for the switch working, you can jumper the long and right blades closed (wires 89 and 53) and manually close the pitcher relay. The pitch motor should run forever and the pitcher relay would stay powered.

ss2 (resized).jpg

IAmTheCzar you are in good hands with baldtwit.

Here is some general info link that may help you as a reference. With the help of pinsiders I made a Williams running man baseball game parts reference list. A lot of the parts over the years were interchangeable and this is why perhaps games are still around today. Here is a link, https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/williams-baseball-game-motor-coils-and-bat-assembly-information#post-6789380 . We have found a minor table mistake on the short stop. I have cross listed the deluxe (#203) and the novelty (#205, i.e. no replay unit). My game and your games are the deluxe replay enabled version and it is game reference #203. It matters as the novelty version had no replay unit or match feature and the schematic would have been a little different.

Your pitcher motor was orginally a can type motor but you have a more heavy duty motor installed and that will be better for the game action. To help you strip-down and rebuild your pitcher unit here is a link to a 63 game with the same pitcher unit. https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/williams-1963-major-league-restoration . The pitcher unit tutorial starts at post #33.

I will be following your journey getting this game back to working condition.

Steve

that's optimistic ...

it's possible switch 3 on the bat relay is correct and the schematic symbol is wrong, so don't turn over the switch yet. On the other hand, if you stuck paper between the switch 3 contacts, the bat should not be able to swing, so I'd guess someone has modified the circuit. Suggest you leave that stuff alone and get the pitching working for now, then deal with the bat if it's not working sensibly.

tmi
----
if the schematic is wrong for bat relay switch 3 and it's supposed to be N.C., it appears you can swing the bat before pitching ... once. If you push the bat lever first:

1] the bat swings and closes the EOS switch
2] the bat relay powers and opens bat relay switch 3.
- the bat relay should stay powered thru a pitcher relay switch 3.
- the bat coil unpowers.
3] since the bat relay is powered, the bat lever switch is now dead and will stay dead until the pitcher relay powers and releases the bat relay.
4] since no ball went over the trough switch, you don't get a strike for the pre-pitch bat swing.

if for some reason someone starts a game, closes the bat switch and walks away without pitching, the bat relay will stay powered forever. A Z-31-2300 should be able to handle that, but if someone put in the wrong coil or just age-related partial shorting of the coil happened, that would explain the charcoaled wood.

if it turns out the above is right and the schematic is wrong, I'll update the schem with a note and resend it to ipdb.

if the schematic is right, then somewhere in the game is a "strike sw." with yellow and green/brown wires on the blades. That switch would need to close to power the bat relay and enable the bat. You could swing the bat as many times as you wanted until the bat relay unpowered. Switch 3 on the bat relay would be upside down and needs to be N.O.

if the switch in the ball trough has black/grey and white/blue wires on it, that's the "trough past ball sw". It causes the strike unit to step up when the bat relay is powered and a ball rolls over the switch to close it ... I assume when the ball gets past the bat and drains in a bottom hole.

Not sure I follow this switch error reasoning, and as you recommend we need the pitcher unit to work correctly before we can move further investigating the switch operation.

This is a general description how the Shortstop works. All Williams baseball games work the same way.

The baseball bat only energizes after the pitch button is pressed and during the pitcher unit throwing cycle. A switch on the pitcher unit energizes as the throwing arm cam is rotated and opens power to the bat relay that in turn provides power to the bat unit lever or button. Slide the lever or press the button and the bat hopefully strikes the ball. Decline to swing the bat no issue just press the pitch button again and the pitching unit fires another ball.

The shortstop has a unique strike feature that if you miss the ball it usually counts as a strike. Two more consecutive misses and the strike unit energizes a switch on the out unit. To make this work better the playfield is sloped away from the bat area unlike all other baseball games so only missed balls can drop into the catch point. It is a nice feature.

If you look at the schematic the answer is the pitch relay energizes the bat relay by energizing switch SW3 shown at G25 on the schematic. The bat SW is the lever or button on the front moulding and J2 on the schematic is now energized.

Before you asked how this pitch relay SW3 switch does this, I will attempt to tell you but baldtwit needs to check me.

Say you press the slow pitch button shown at K24 on the schematic, it energizes the pitcher relay directly. All 3 pitcher relay switches will change state to closed including SW3.

Say you press the fast pitch button shown at K24 on the schematic its a little more convoluted as it needs to also energize the fast solenoid and the fast pitch relay switches. Soon as the fast pitch relay energizes the pitcher relay it’s switches change state and power the pitcher relay including SW3.

if this is one of those ambiguities about when "normally" is and the usual state of the bat relay is being powered, then it works like you describe.

question is tho, how does the bat relay get powered initially? Looks like only the strike switch can do it, and I dunno what/where that thing is.

while the bat may look to the player to work the same on the williams games, the circuit for all the schems I've seen is slightly different on all of them. The only ones that aren't clear are short-stop and the game before it

wrt czar's latest problem, if the pitch motor doesn't stop, it should be one of the switches around the cam edge isn't changing state when the stack changes state (falls into a cam notch or gets lifted by a cam lobe). Make sure the stack is following the cam edge and not floating above the cam, then check the switches are doing something that makes sense.

The strike switch is situated where the ball falls when missed by the batter. See picture. IMG_2860 (resized).jpg

The strike switch, bat relay SW1 and bat unit EOS are all wired in parallel except the bat relay SW1 has the pitcher SW3 upstream and are located at H25 on the schematic.

On pic 2 of 3, the top make/break switch looks like the long blade is not touching the short blade under it.

pinballdaveh is right:

The make/break switch stack in the 3 o’clock position on the pitch cam is in the hold circuit for the pitch relays . Clean and check switch for proper relay operation.

IAmTheCzar,

It’s great your pitch buttons now work. We need to fix the cam . The reason the cam is not sitting correctly is the spring is not sitting in position (please be careful with the spring as they are currently unobtanium). You will need to recoil the spring. We need an E clip and possibly some skinny washers to keep the cam on the shaft. this is the next item to fix as we are nowing getting close to fixing you game.

I knew I was not completely sure how this game works when baldtwit asked me how does this game energize the bat relay. I looked at how my game works (seems to me to be working correctly).

I need to update the action of the Shortstop as follows;

1. The first time you switch this game on the bat relay is not energized.
2. The bat lever WILL fire the first time as bat relay switch SW3 (110V) is located after the bat switch in series and is in a closed position.
3. This activates the bat EOS to energize the bat relay for the next ball.
4. We press the pitch button and this activates the pitcher relay deenergizing the bat relay.
5. This closes the bat lever bat relay SW3 for one swing.
6. And the cycle repeats.

Point is the bat lever is live at the start of every game on the Short Stop.

Here is what the pitcher relay switches should be positioned like without the pitcher relay energized.
IMG_2863 (resized).jpg
Here is a picture of how the bat relay switches should be like without the bat relay being energized.
IMG_2864 (resized).jpg
for grins here is the fast pitch relay which we know is correct as you have told us they work.
IMG_2865 (resized).jpg

Post E is screwed in and out. It is out when cam is tensioned or opposite. It is screwed in when you are finished and put back in the game.

Do you take the pitcher unit out of the game when you work on it? I do.

First remove the clip and washers,
Hold the pitch lever and carefully release the dogs as you hold the cam and as you release the spring the dogs slip into the cams again. Keep a good grip as you keep rotating the cam until the tension is released. The dogs will help as they re-enter the cam dwell as it rotates.

The spring can be recentered and you hold the pitcher lever and rotate the cam using the dogs to lock every rotation. You need to get as much tension as possible.

Good luck.

Last question is what rpm and voltage is the motor? It should be stamped on the motor.

Good Morning IAmTheCzar,
Looked at your second video (missed it yesterday). Looks like you are there, everything is working correctly. Fix the switch that HowardR and Pinballdaveh mentioned and that will power the pitcher Re with the pitch buttons.

You may need to check continuity between the pitch buttons and the pitcher relay. Get a 3’ long wire with two alligator clips on the ends and connect directly. You have three Jones plugs to check out if you get the jumper to energize the pitcher relay.

The strike sw is not supposed to fire if the bat has pulled as they are an either or to deenergize the bat relay. The lever DOES work on the first pull as yours does.

Send us another video of the game working.

Steve

steve emailed me pics of his revised schematic. I merged the changes and submitted to ipdb. Until it shows up, you can grab the updated schem from https://bingo.cdyn.com/ppm/short-stop/