(Topic ID: 83404)

1947 Singapore United pinball machine

By SteveFury

10 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic Gallery

    View topic image gallery

    20140405_102527.jpg
    20140405_102604.jpg
    20140309_215323.jpg
    Bumper.jpg
    20140329_144817.jpg
    Bonus 2.jpg
    Bonus 1.jpg
    20140328_151055.jpg
    20140328_145416.jpg
    20140328_145504.jpg
    20140327_170733.jpg
    20140327_170839.jpg
    20140327_170826.jpg
    20140326_073651.jpg
    20140325_235401.jpg
    20140324_064732.jpg

    There are 119 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
    #1 10 years ago

    I might be picking up one of these this afternoon.a
    http://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?id=2161
    I've never broke down a wood rail pinball machine for transportation. How is this done?
    Thanks
    -Steve

    #2 10 years ago

    Break down is pretty much the same as the later EMs. Backbox sits directly on the bottom cab, held in with 2 or 3 large blots (flat head slots). Jones plugs to undo too.

    Remove the balls first of course, back legs off, tip up, front legs off. United probably used the same size leg bolts as everyone else.

    #3 10 years ago
    Quoted from SteveFury:

    I've never broke down a wood rail pinball machine for transportation. How is this done?

    I have never broke one down either but I'm sure the usual stuff applies with removing Head and Legs. I'm sure others will chime in with more in depth advice.

    Is this a retrofit model with Flippers Steve?

    Good luck in your quest.

    Ken

    #4 10 years ago

    take a good look at the wooden legs for major cracks around the bolt holes

    #5 10 years ago

    Well I guess this is the start of a rebuild thread. I picked this up from Craigs List for $60. I think it was a fair price for both parties for the machine's condition.

    It was stored under a carport without a glass and the elements have taken its toll. Most severe problem is that parts of the playfield has delaminated. I was wondering if anyone has had any successful methods of repairing this problem. If not then I will probably just inject wood glue underneath and clamp it. I've done that process before with wood radio cases but the results aren't great.
    Any ideas? Otherwise I think the paint is OK underneath the dirt.

    The main redeeming aspect of this machine is the back glass which appears to be in VGC. The machine was manufactured without flippers, and these flippers are after-market add-ons. I haven't decided whether to keep them installed or remove them as part of the PF rebuild. I am currently leaning toward removing them.

    Other than that it seems to be a fairly straight forward EM rebuild with the usual problems. Dirt, rust, stuck mechanics. Here are some "before" pictures as it just entered my home:
    20140309_202812.jpg20140309_202812.jpg
    20140309_212839.jpg20140309_212839.jpg
    20140309_205714.jpg20140309_205714.jpg
    20140309_211519.jpg20140309_211519.jpg
    20140309_212438.jpg20140309_212438.jpg

    #6 10 years ago

    A few more pics:

    20140309_203224.jpg20140309_203224.jpg
    20140309_211610.jpg20140309_211610.jpg
    20140309_211645.jpg20140309_211645.jpg
    20140309_211755.jpg20140309_211755.jpg
    20140309_204608.jpg20140309_204608.jpg

    #7 10 years ago

    ....And these pics:

    Flipper.jpgFlipper.jpg
    20140309_215545.jpg20140309_215545.jpg
    20140309_211846.jpg20140309_211846.jpg

    #8 10 years ago

    I have very little wood working skills. But could the playfield top veneer be removed and applied to new plywood surface? Getting the back planed off. Or would it be better to just make a new playfield and use decals to reproduce the art work. Either way it seems to be a lot of work. The backglass does not look to bad. Keep us posted.

    #9 10 years ago
    Quoted from Darcy:

    Or would it be better to just make a new playfield and use decals to reproduce the art work.

    I may do this if I can't fix the original satisfactorily. Yea, a lot of work for sure. I might take it to a cabinet shop and see what they may or may not be able to do. I figure 200-300 hours of work to make this pin "right".

    #10 10 years ago

    A Cabinet shop should be able to rebuild the cabinet perfectly. I can assume that the lower panel is toast. The reds on this pin should really stand out when your done. The yellow lanterns, it is nice to see cabinet art actually match the theme of the pin. Is the top ball arch repairable?

    #11 10 years ago

    Wow. Were you planning to remove the flipper mod?

    #12 10 years ago

    Have fun with the restore Steve.

    I'm sure when you are done it will look as sharp as your other 2 pins.

    Ken

    #13 10 years ago

    Here's one stripped playfield ready for cleaning. Looks better already with out those crustation-coated and rusty parts. Don't remind me how much I *hate* unsoldering pop bumper lights.

    The lower cabinet isn't too bad except for the split corner shown in the photo. I should be able to handle that with some internal bracing, glue and clamping. I'll probably respray the cabinet with original artwork.

    I really love the artwork on the PF and I'll probably just do the glue and clamp trick for the delamination. Then seal it in Varathane to hopefully stop any further degradation. It certainly won't be a perfect PF and I expect the ball to take a couple "odd" turns along the way. But all I can do is all I can do.

    I haven't had the back glass out of the machine yet. I have looked it over more closely from the outside and it does look like a bit of paint is missing or has flaked off or otherwise gotten "thin". I've been practicing my air brush skills over the past months and I think I could make some templates and do a decent fix.

    Flippers:
    There's a heavy nylon busing driven into the flipper PF hole. I'd probably do damage trying to get it back out. However I can fit a post over the flipper shaft hole and secure it with a long screw, large washer and nut. That's where a post is supposed to go anyway. I will keep the flipper parts in case I want to refit them.

    I should be able to get my *1st* order in to PB resource tomorrow evening. Steve Young is gonna love me with this one.

    20140310_025033.jpg20140310_025033.jpg

    This is a video I found of someone else's game which has an almost identical PF:

    #14 10 years ago

    Amazing the Backglass looks that good !
    ******* Good Luck Steve *************

    #15 10 years ago

    God bless you! I would have taken the backglass as a wall hanging and parted/trashed the rest. This isn't meant to discourage you of course, and I'm sure it will turn out nice. Looking forward to seeing photos of the progress.

    #16 10 years ago

    Nice project SteveFury, looks like you have your work cut out for you.
    Good luck.

    #17 10 years ago

    That looks like a super fun restore. I cant wait to see the progress!

    --Jeff

    #18 10 years ago

    I spent a few hours with a cotton cloth and 90% alcohol last night cleaning the PF. It looks a lot better. I'll need to repaint both the left & right lane areas for peeling paint. Once I get the lower bonus area glued flat as possible, I plan to use some fine sandpaper with a very light touch to remove the top layer of "stuff". I'll make a template of the painted areas around the lower bonus area, so I can repaint them later.
    If it still looks like crap after sanding then I might need to paint where the wood is now.

    One redeeming thing is the fonts are made to look like hand writing which will make it easier to reproduce.

    I made a quick re-laminating jig from some scrap wood, a couple deck screws and felt. I need to see how the glue has flowed in the joint before it dries... Otherwise I might be disappointed to find the glue had seeped up and out onto the surface of the PF, making a hard mess. So I am using a square of plexiglass to apply even pressure and act as a window. You can see the white strip of glue sitting pretty in the crack under the screw. I glued felt to the bottom of the heel board on the bottom opposite side of the jig so the wood won't damage the existing paint.
    I guess that's about 30lbs of 78rpm records focusing most of the weight on the joint. I think this process will work well for the rest of the board.

    I soaked all the pop bumper parts overnight in a laundry soap solution. I found all the encrusted barnacles ready to be brushed off this morning. I don't want to spend any more money than possible on this wreck of a pin... and it won't be showroom quality so I am reusing the original bumpers. They are yellowed but not warped (much) and not cracked. The yellowing is kind of a "marble" texture.

    I also got a chance to disassemble the non-working nickel coin slide last night, and clean it out. I made it work and buffed the corrosion off the aluminum framing with #0000 steel wool.

    I got my 1st order in to PBR. New balls, levelers, pop bumper springs, new posts & screws, new shooter parts etc etc etc.

    20140311_135139.jpg20140311_135139.jpg
    20140311_135113.jpg20140311_135113.jpg
    Post cleaning.jpgPost cleaning.jpg

    #19 10 years ago
    Quoted from SteveFury:

    I got my 1st order in to PBR. New balls, levelers, pop bumper springs, new posts & screws, new shooter parts etc etc etc.

    No wonder the line was busy for so long this morning when I tried to order parts!

    #20 10 years ago

    The marbling was intentional on many of the older games plastics. Think these were that way originally Steve or is it actually fading?

    #21 10 years ago

    congrats on the score steve. you bring this machine back from the dead and you will haved earned a spot in pinball heaven! looking so forward to seeing more pics.

    #22 10 years ago
    Quoted from Garrett:

    Think these were that way originally Steve or is it actually fading?

    I've really deep cleaned and waxed all these pop bumpers, skirts, mounts and covers. All but 1 looks new. The 1 has a dark ring behind where the rubber ring goes. No big deal. I've polished the parts and they simply look great. I do think they've browned somewhat over time and that the effect has deepened the marble tone.

    I called Steve Young at PBR this afternoon. One of my needed parts was the shooter plunger. Steve explained the United used an oddball diameter shooter, and he'd have to rummage boxes at his home to find one. He asked me to take some length dimensions.
    I suggested to him that I could tool out the beehive if necessary to fit a standard diameter shooter. He said it was forged with a brass insert and drilling isn't possible. That *really* had me concerned.
    But luck and fate seem to be on my side.
    I just removed the shooter plunger from my Space Mission, and someone before me had already tooled the Singapore's beehive to fit a standard plunger. I'm really just beside myself and sincerely thank this mystery person from the bottom of my heart. The beehive has some sort of sleeve in it. Sliding the plunger into the beehive is not metal to metal. I wonder if they fixed it to fit a standard sleeve like in the Williams shooter assemblies? Hmm....

    The PF is coming along nicely. The PF split in my previous post came out perfectly flat and solid. I've just done the lifted veneer around the center switch just below the upper kickout hole. Completely fixed. I have the first lane of one of the side lanes drying now.

    The game counter says 01282. I believe this count to be accurate because the counter itself is operating and there's no actual ball damage to the PF. Yea, lots of other elements related issues but no obvious ball wear. The arch has some dark staining but no groove. The game came with 2 balls of solid rust which I believe caused the minor arch staining by someone before me.

    I'll also have my work cut out for me when I get to the electronics. Someone foiled the fuses. Not good. A stepper solenoid is stuck almost solid. I got brave and plugged it in but no power anywhere. The line cord is spliced in 3 sections. At this point who knows.
    Hope I can get a schematic.

    Looks like the United Rondeevoo is very similar to the Singapore:

    #23 10 years ago

    Great project!
    I can't wait to see this all cleaned up, good luck and have fun!

    #24 10 years ago

    Hey Steve,

    Seeing you already have the Operator installed Flippers I would keep them.

    I think it makes the game more fun seeing you can fight to try to keep the ball on the topside for a longer period.

    If it never had the Flippers installed then I would have just left it stock.

    Just my 2 cents.

    Seems like your repairs are going better than you expected which is great!

    Ken

    #25 10 years ago

    It's looking better already! I admire your spirit and tenacity!

    #26 10 years ago

    Hi Ken.
    Definitely going to save the flipper parts, and make instructions how to install them for the next person.

    My veneer flattening process has been working so far. This lane area was all lifted up and wavy - warped:
    20140313_033624.jpg20140313_033624.jpg

    I'm leaving this setup to dry the first lane overnight:
    20140313_033447.jpg20140313_033447.jpg
    The area drying is the single lane between the screw tips. You can see how the wavy/warped unglued PF is lifted around the slot not covered by the plexiglass square:
    20140313_033536.jpg20140313_033536.jpg

    I got real anxious about the glass tonight and removed it for inspection. Although some parts are peeling, I don't think it's all that bad. So far, the main damaged color is white. I plan to be EXTREMELY careful and remove the unattached flakes and airbrush using the lowest air pressure possible.

    Question:
    Suppose I can successfully repair the flaked areas on this glass. What is the best way to prevent further degradation? Does anyone suggest I use Triple Thick?
    20140313_034248.jpg20140313_034248.jpg
    20140313_034312.jpg20140313_034312.jpg

    #27 10 years ago

    I've had mixed results with "triple thick". Sometimes it seems to expand incipient cracks in the ink once it dries. I would try a water based clear on an older glass such as this one, but maybe just try one small section first to be safe.

    #28 10 years ago

    looking like progress is being made...

    i love this pic... cool weighting system...

    image-196.jpgimage-196.jpg

    #29 10 years ago
    Quoted from SteveFury:

    What is the best way to prevent further degradation? Does anyone suggest I use Triple Thick?

    I have only used Triple Thick with a couple Backglasses and I'm very happy with it. I'm sure others will chime in that have more experience using different techniques and options.

    Ken

    #30 10 years ago

    I think the thermal stability is a possible issue with Triple Thick. Once you go there, you need to keep the glass in a temp./humidity stable environment. (see various other threads here and on RGP for stories) I have used it on dozens of games and feel the trade off is worth it-for a glass with lifting/peeling/flaking issues such as yours.

    #32 10 years ago
    Quoted from way2wyrd:

    This shooter??

    Yes, exactly that one. In fact just today I've wire wheeled the rust from both the lifter lever and the beehive/frame, and repainted the frame. Getting ready for a box of parts to arrive.

    #33 10 years ago
    Quoted from SteveFury:

    Yes, exactly that one. In fact just today I've wire wheeled the rust from both the lifter lever and the beehive/frame, and repainted the frame. Getting ready for a box of parts to arrive.

    Steve,
    Its like Christmas in..................... March ???
    A new toy to play with.....

    #34 10 years ago

    I've been with my employer for almost 15 years now. I just found out my job is scheduled to end in late June due to economy related cutbacks. Looks like SteveFury will be joining the 14% unemployed ranks.
    This news both threatens this project and accelerates it. I need to get it done ASAP as I begin to focus on other matters.

    I have almost all the loose veneer reglued as I also work on various other things like stripping rust etc.

    #35 10 years ago

    Sorry to hear that Steve.

    #36 10 years ago
    Quoted from SteveFury:

    I've been with my employer for almost 15 years now. I just found out my job is scheduled to end in late June due to economy related cutbacks. Looks like SteveFury will be joining the 14% unemployed ranks.

    Sorry to hear Steve and understand as I have been unemployed since October 2013. One of these days I have to start making some money again.

    Ken

    #37 10 years ago

    Has any Pinsiders asked yet, What the hell is a 78?

    #38 10 years ago
    Quoted from Darcy:

    What the hell is a 78?

    A 78 rpm Record.

    Ken

    #39 10 years ago

    Do not forget the 16 2/3 rpm ones.

    #40 10 years ago

    I have a bit more done.
    My local Walmart's don't have the tripple thick so I ordered one along with 2 cans Varathane gloss. My PBR box should arrive next week. I have a lot to do.

    In the mean time, this is the last veneer repair. It all came down reasonably flat.
    The bonus area paint (Row of 10 lights) is beyond repair. I plan to make a template, light sand and re-apply with airbrush. The fonts used look like brush strokes anyway:
    Clamp-821.jpgClamp-821.jpg

    I wire wheeled the rust off the beehive, bracket and lifting parts. 3 Coats of gray grill paint and 4 coats clear. I gave the shiny ball lift lever extra polishing with #0000 steel wool, then added a few coats of Miniwax Paste Wax to prevent it from rusting again:
    Lever-802.jpgLever-802.jpg

    I thought I might have to re-spray the PF red because of the flaked paint/speckles. I was able to avoid this by using my finger to smudge an approximate color red Liqutex heavy body acrylic paint down into the blemishes... then wipe sideways with a clean finger and clean-up with a damp cloth. I am happy with the results. I'll probably have to do something about that lady's cracked head though:
    Red-182.jpgRed-182.jpg

    I was very concerned about this horrible wood, whether it would fix or if I'd have to paint it. I found out I can sand off the varnish and the wood itself looks a lot better. It took me about 1.5 hours to remove the varnish from the boxed area, but you can see it looks a lot cleaner:
    Varnsides.jpgVarnsides.jpg

    #41 10 years ago

    In the flattening process are the larger split areas shrinking back together? Will you need to fill the split with something other than paint?

    Pins older than 1960, rarely appear for sale here in Alberta. Since last year, 1 1930's Bally, another Pin that was powered by a battery pack. There were 2 50's games, and that was it.

    #42 10 years ago
    Quoted from Darcy:

    In the flattening process are the larger split areas shrinking back together?

    Most splits weren't too bad and small enough that the glue had filled them in. These are the two main cracks I had to fill:

    Gaps.jpgGaps.jpg

    I air brushed the shadow offset/primer layer of the lanes today. This is how I did them:

    First I traced out the original artwork using a sharpie pen on wax paper. The wax paper is thin enough to see through.

    Template.jpgTemplate.jpg

    I will be destroying the original artwork and I want to keep the wax paper image safe so I traced it onto regular paper. Just placing the paper on top of the wax paper wasn't good enough to see.
    To see the image for tracing, I put the wax paper image on a sheet of glass, and regular paper on top. Then I put a lamp to shine underneath and traced it onto the paper.

    Tracing.jpgTracing.jpg

    Then I cut the pattern out of the paper, and used it to cut an airbrush stencil. The stencil material is simply a flat, uncreased cereal box side. I taped masking paper around it and made sure it laid flat on the PF then airbrushed several coats of light medium gray Liquitex acrylic paint. This is both the base primer layer and offset:

    Painting.jpgPainting.jpg

    The next layer will be almost white and placed a few mm up and to the side so the gray creates a drop shadow. I also plan to paint the strips on the L&R walls next to the lanes. This is what I have, as the gray is allowed to dry:

    pf.jpgpf.jpg

    I think those left and right lanes are going to REALLY stand out... not really matching the rest of the PF. Oh well. Anyway those lanes set up the bonus's and coveted areas to reach. Maybe it will work out in the end. The other colors should come out better once it's sealed.

    I am still considering painting over the wood in the green highlighted area below. What do you think? I might be able to clean the wood a little better by sanding but not by much. It's pretty much stained.

    20140316_134351.jpg20140316_134351.jpg

    What do you think? To paint the lower end or not?

    #43 10 years ago
    Quoted from SteveFury:

    I am still considering painting over the wood in the green highlighted area below. What do you think? I might be able to clean the wood a little better by sanding but not by much. It's pretty much stained.

    If your not happy with the wood as-is then maybe a light stain instead of paint? Just a thought.

    Ken

    #44 10 years ago

    I love those old United games,especially the artwork.It's good to see someone digging in to save one of them.I am always on the lookout for another old United project,not that I am finished with the one I am working on now...Those old Woodrails all finished out with all the stained trimwork are spectacular.Really looking forward to see how this one progresses!

    #45 10 years ago

    I have a question for anyone in the know about these types of machines. If nobody knows I'll find out soon enough

    This is the way the mechanism works.
    1. You put in the nickel and push in the slide. This does a few things:
    a. The action of you operating the nickel slide moves mechanisms which latches all the relays, a row of about 10 or so. The relays unlatch when a bumper (letter) is hit etc during game play.
    b. A barrier lifts (opens) which allows all 5 balls to drop in line for the shooter.

    *An important note to make is the player MANUALLY resets the relays and releases the ball by mechanical means operated by the nickel slide. The reset tasks are -not- done by solenoids like the more modern EM games.* (I am working on an animation of this action)

    2. With the relays latched and the balls at the shooter (and stepper resets completed), the game is ready to play.

    My question is how is the game replay counter used?
    You can adjust the replay scores in the back similar to the more modern EM's but something doesn't make sense to me.

    The nickel rejector will only slide far enough to reset the relays and release the balls if there is a nickel inserted. Also, there's a solenoid to close the ball barrier gate but not to open it.

    Why have a replay counter when replays can't be free (You must insert a nickel to reset the game)?

    Also...
    I'll be starting the bonus area repaint tonight.
    My goal is NOT to make the machine look new, or change it's theme etc. The existing paint is flat dead. I want to end up with a game which someone looks at and thinks "This is a nice game I want to play" rather than "Will I catch a disease if I go near it". So I'll end up with a mixture of old and new. Hopefully it will work together. Not to bad considering.

    #46 10 years ago

    Does this offer any clue?

    http://ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=2161&picno=41529

    I suppose a check of the schematic to see what activates the credit unit decrement solenoid would be another clue (if you have the schematic).

    #47 10 years ago

    Thanks DirtFlipper. I have those labels still attached to my machine. I have searched and searched and searched for a schematic. I've abandoned trying to get the Singapore specific schematic but broadened my search for -any- United pinball within a few years. They don't seem to exist. Steve at PBR hasn't seen any either, only for shuffle games etc.

    I got my box from PBR. Those guys are great. I hope to get my Amazon box with the sprays in a day or so.

    Tripplethick question.
    This is the 1st time I've done this with a glass. Given my photos, how would you proceed? The white paint flakes fly off like dust if even breathed on, so I plan to have my 1st few coats sprayed from a far distance... maybe a foot or so. Then let it dry and add more coats, each coat a bit thicker than the last.

    Is that the way it's done? When I am finished spraying, how thick is too thick? How do I know that it is not thick enough and need additional coats? Do I stop adding coats when I believe the original print has become stable again?
    Thank you for any suggestions you may have.

    In the mean time, I've done a bit more painting. I like the drop shadow on the ball lanes. I've traced out the artwork on the bonus lights area and will be reproducing it. I'll be trying some new *official* blank stencil material I got from Michael's. I plan to try and make a balance between the obvious new paint and the original paint. I believe the bonus area might actually turn out pretty good:

    20140318_142242.jpg20140318_142242.jpg
    20140318_142322.jpg20140318_142322.jpg
    20140318_142348.jpg20140318_142348.jpg

    #48 10 years ago
    Quoted from SteveFury:

    so I plan to have my 1st few coats sprayed from a far distance... maybe a foot or so. Then let it dry and add more coats, each coat a bit thicker than the last.

    That's what I would do Steve. Just make sure you block off the Score Wheel & credit windows with some cut cardboard/business card squares to block the spray as it will fog the clear glass if sprayed. Once you get the spray to hold the paint specs after a couple different passes/times, then lay on 2 thick coats to seal.

    Ken

    #49 10 years ago
    Quoted from EM-PINMAN:

    That's what I would do Steve. Just make sure you block off the Score Wheel & credit windows with some cut cardboard/business card squares to block the spray as it will fog the clear glass if sprayed. Once you get the spray to hold the paint specs after a couple different passes/times, then lay on 2 thick coats to seal.
    Ken

    Ditto.

    Overlap the spray lines, and also rotate 90 degrees, so it's covered with horizontal passes and then with vertical passes. Once the existing ink is stable and adhering, a final 'wet' coat will seal it in.

    Probably not an issue this time of year, but avoid using the stuff when it's really hot and humid. Clouds up, and doesn't dry well.

    #50 10 years ago

    Steve,
    Tripplethick question.
    This is the 1st time I've done this with a glass. Given my photos, how would you proceed? The white paint flakes fly off like dust if even breathed on, so I plan to have my 1st few coats sprayed from a far distance... maybe a foot or so. Then let it dry and add more coats, each coat a bit thicker than the last.
    ..........................................................................................................................................................
    You may want to try this method on a small section of your Backglass .........

    There are 119 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.

    Reply

    Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

    Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

    Donate to Pinside

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


    This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/1947-singapore-united-pinball-machine and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

    Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.