Lawsuit threats in 3...2....1...

WOW....that's bad.

Every Stern I have gotten in the last three years has had issues out of the box as well. Some pretty major. Welcome to pinball.

did you just come out of an 18 month hibernation?

frogs snacks. lol

_{Post edited by Ballsofsteel: TWC}

What the F#@* are you tailing about he has started 42 threads

Yeah seriously.....rlevin ain't new around here..

Crazy.

Chattanooga Pinball? I remember them from shenanigans years ago on RGP

See the [1] next to his name in the little blue box? That means he's not new.

Most I have seen out of the box had issues. Some an easy fix others not so easy.

Really curious what machine you had 12 hours of labor on? I can do a complete playfield swap in less than that.

PM me ticket numbers. I'll research.

You should see many distributors and your customers posting about you and your lack of ability and support of anything related to pinball. Stop while you are ahead.

This is a good reason why I will not entertain the thoughts of WOZ or any future JJP game for the time being.

Dale is upset because we removed him as a distributor. We will not sell games to him because he will not support them. We had to send service people right around the corner from him basically to service them - I paid for those service calls - Dale - better way to do this was just to call me - too bad - I'm sorry for your troubles but usually some level of knowledge is needed to repair anything with newer technology - assuming a pinball is a pinball is not the best way to go.

Best to you Dale - I'm happy you are feeling better - that's what really matters!

Dude the OP is Dale (Choochoo arcades) he has been in the industry for a long time and is a good guy.
I am one of the guys waiting on a Hobbit deposit refund from him, but not because I'm buying one elsewhere.
Thanks for working with me Dale!
Sean
In Pleasant Hill, OR

mmm hmmm..

just toss this into google

"rec games pinball chattanooga pinball"

/facepalm.

Wasn't really interested in the origin.. I just question using your choice to do that as a persuasive point in an argument or whatever you want to call it.

Thanks for taking the responsibility of caring for other people's kids that they didn't care about enough to do it themselves. Regardless of your business reputation, that is not something I can argue with.

Well... wait until I post the full story of my ST LE NIB unboxed today. I've started in the ST club post, and it's not over... I've not yet played a single ball, I will post the rest of the story... The best DIB (Defect in Box) I've ever had/heard of.
I and most of my friends have had a few issues with our WOZ but mostly screws (switches, coil stops etc..) that were not properly tightened or other small issues, nothing dramatic.

I can vouch for Jack on this. I fixed a problem with a WOZ sold by Chattanooga Pinball to a really nice couple in Chattanooga. The issue was light boards and noone had ever set up the pin for them. I drove down there from Nashvillle and spent most of the day with them, fixing the problem, getting their machine dialed in, and showing them how to diagnose and fix future problems. Chattanooga Pinball just more or less dropped off the game and never set it up; amateur hour in my opinion. I am not a tech, nor ever will be, but you don't treat customers like that. Jack asked me to fix the problem because he wanted his customer to be happy. Last I heard, they love the game. The couple was extremely frustrated with their abandoment by Chattanooga Pinball.

Some love Chattanooga Pinball, some hate them. I would never deal with them based on what I Have heard from people that have first hand experience with them. Dale may be a great guy, but his company has some very unhappy customers.

You've had bad luck then. We've had minor issues (bulb falling out, rubber causing balls to get stuck, etc, but Wizard of Oz???? That's been nothing but major problems for most people, even the one we had that we were allowed to borrow kindly).

And this is coming from someone who basically has bought 7 out of the last 9 Sterns new in box...

Also keep in mind Stern has stuff that most of us can address, sometimes you "can't" address the issues Wizard of Oz has. New power boards?? Come on...

Well you have to understand, a "new in box pinball" will end up COSTING Dale money as a business with all of the addressing of issues with a "new" pinball. It should never be that way. Heck, I don't sell pinballs and set them up that way myself because it is like a car...you can end up having numerous problems with all the "warranty" and "free" labor issues guaranteeing stuff like that. Our pins work but you and I both know transporting can cause all issues to happen.

Regardless there is no excuse on how these pins have had issues and for it to be expected that Dale should go above and beyond (he will end up losing money) then why should be sell them in the first place?????

If he promises initial setup, great, but there are more "dialing in" issues with Wizard of Oz than all the Sterns combined we have ever had....I just don't see how as a business Chattanooga Pinball "wins" in this situation.

Man, sorry you are having issues Rlevin. 17 out of 17? I've had a great Woz experience and found JJP, Jen and Jack to be great with customer. Including Lloyd in there as well.

Whatever the issue is I'm sure it will get fixed.

I understand your point, but leveling the pin, setting the outlanes, adjusting the menu system, etc are not something someone that pays full retail should have to do on their own. We both know pinball and can do these things ourselves, but there is a minimum amount of service that should come with a high dollar purchase. They don't hand you the keys when you buy a car. Even the company who installs a new a/c system at a house walks you through using the thermostat. If you order via the web and just have it delivered, then you take your chances, but not when you buy at full price from a brick and mortar shop ... especially for a customer who has never owned a pinball machine.

Would you guys stop winning. Good Lord live in my neck of the woods. We have no pinball techs that I am aware of within 100 miles. Look I agree, the game has issues from time to time but don't they all. Heck, I bought a working SWEP1 game in Dallas played it and loaded it in my trailer got it home and now it doesn't work. It happens and I am not happy about it but one day this year I will find someone to fix it. Yes, Jack I agree there are some problem with the business tech system. I posted many tickets with no answers only later to find out. Hey post your issues here and was told by we don't check tickets that often. Why have the system in place if it doesn't work? However, that being said, I got my problems fixed within a few days. Happy customer! love JJP and will buy from again. Now if I could only get that SWEP1 working

I love hearing that from you, because I honestly want you to succeed. You are a positive for pinball in the area. Just like JJP, you need to make money to stay in business.

Concerning unhappy customers, I can't release names of people who have conveyed stories, you know that. That would be betraying their trust. I hope that it is only a few on your side.

Dale, what was most disappointing about the repairs that I made on the WOZ was how relatively easy they were for even an idiot like me. Perhaps your techs already handled the tough ones, but their knowledge level should be so far beyond mine. Regardless, the WOZ should have been set up properly.
You sell pins for a very high price relative to private party sales. I would expect top notch service to go with it.

I wish you the best ... and thanks for taking care of those kids.

Dale, why dont you just let Alex take care of the problems. He tried to talk shit about me, but the customer that i started this thread about still doesnt have their game fixed. I guess Alex is good on his computer, just not with helping people and FOLLOWING THROUGH to make sure that they are happy

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/jjp-has-very-poor-customer-service-for-non-pinheads

Oh, and this was a game that had issues right out of the box. So i know exactly what your dealing with. JJP fanboys can flame away, just remember, im only complaining about the JJP service that I have had to deal with. Myself, I have my own WOZLE that i have never had one issue with, not even a light board. So its not that im complaing about the game, just how things are handled with customers.

So you are saying that anyone that orders from any distributor should have that person "fly" in or "drive" in from wherever to do that? There are tons of distributors out there, most of them people that do this in their spare time. Heck, ours (FlipnOut Pinball) already goes above and beyond basically driving to Nashville from Kentucky to bring us games 2 hours away...I do not think that it should be expected to "set up" said game as well.....

The company that does the AC is local...very different scenario. Now again, if Dale did not set it up and it was in Chattanooga, (which I think is what you are saying) then that would be an issue, but someone out of state?? What do you propose? It's essentially an impossible task.

Doesn't sound like anyone is "winning."

OK I see, Dale had a transport company bring the pin.

Again, what would someone propose for something like this? It's almost as if you had to have someone with expertise on these for new pinball buyers, especially out of area ones....

I don't think anyone is going to suggest that distributors support pins they don't sell (although that could be a part of the distributor agreement), but the best distributors will support pins they sell that are outside their locale. If pinball distributors ever expect to sell to non-pinball people, they should be aware of reasonable expectations of the public. This is not a private club ... anyone can get in. But, by allowing anyone in, the distributors should be aware and be willing to support their products or provide a clear "you are on your own" disclaimer with each sale, which would effectively kill any sale.

On the part between Dale and Jack, that is determined by the distributor agreement. If it is not profitable for Dale, he should ask out. If Jack thinks Dale is not holding up to his end of the agreement, then Jack should terminate the agreement. That is between them and is a completely different topic than what a customer should expect from a distributor. The couple in Chattanooga rightfully felt abandoned. Their expectations of more support were justified ... and in my opinion Dale should have taken care of them as he sold them the pin. His name was the one that was going to get dragged through the mud if nothing was fixed.

I would be shocked if these guys make more than $300-700 on a pinball wholesale. It's a lot of capital to put out for little profit especially with known issues.

The real factor here is that their pins have board problems.

The reason why people are all over Wizard of OZ is because it is the prettiest pin ever made. Now most people know how I feel about the gameplay being subpar at best, but it's an eye catcher (as is Cirqus Voltaire) and once people see it, they want it and it's "family" oriented in the house...

We have no distributor for these in Nashville. Closest ones are FLipNOut and Chattanooga Pinball, each 2 hours away....

Personally I've never been asked for the machine here or where to buy it, and I've got more pins on location than anyone in the Southeast that I know of....so it's all relative I suppose.

Rev, why are you moving over here and starting this crap. Got booted from Klov for same reasons like this. Look at some of the topics this rlevin has started.

Topics started titled:

"FUNNY got in trouble with Stern yesterday"
"Well I CHATTANOOGA PINBALL Was WRONG About Stern"
"Changes From Stern Prepare To Pay More"

This guy is toxic.

I believe that the numbers you quote are closer to Stern numbers. Since JJP mandates no discounts, the margin is much higher from the numbers I have seen. Regardless, it is all about the stipulations in the distributor contract as far as support that they must provide. We are not privy to those terms. I just believe that you support what you sell, even if it means taking a loss now and then. If the profits from other sales don't make up for those losses, then it is time to terminate the agreement. If Dale has sold 167 WOZs, then the profit would justify his support I would think.

You and I will disagree on the WOZ gameplay as it is my favorite by far. That said, you are an operator, and a damn good one. I respect your opinion.

I think 167 was a typo; he meant 17.

All of you complaining about what he is saying obviously have never been in business for yourself.

Would you sell something for a $500 profit if you knew 100% of the time you would have hours of service that would be needed on each? All coming out of YOUR pocket? He essentially makes nothing on each of those sales, has a bunch of pissed off customers blaming him for a buggy product, and he came here to vent his frustration. I don't blame him...

Everyone here knows these things have issues.