** Scroll to my most recent post to see the progression of the problem I am diagnoising. I am leaving everything untouched from previous "trail and error" progression posts. **

So I have the typical "game looks for ball and trips all solenoids after multiball is over" deal on TFTC, and I've always wondered how to test the switches. I've read up on this, and I know one of my ball trough switches is bad - my question is: how do I test them and determine which one it is? I have 3 new switches, and I don't feel getting another 3 and replacing all 6 is the efficient way to do things. I want to know what I should look for - open circuit, infinite resistance, no voltage, etc - to determine which switch is bad so I can go in, take the old one out, and install a new one.

Thank you for your time.

Good place to start, LTG. Thanks !

Ok, so here's where I am at with this situation. All the switches worked and register as they should.

The coil that kicks a ball from the trough to the shooter lane (the coil in the 6-Ball Switch Assembly, part # 500-5683-01 in the manual, is sometimes not firing strongly enough. This causes the ball to sit on the solenoid. Once multiball is over, the game sees there are only 5 balls but 6 switches, so it goes into "auto find ball" mode, and then the solenoid pops the ball strongly enough into the shooter lane.

I have also noticed this problem with the super VUK in the back right of the playfield (part number 500-5116-06); however, at least the this one keeps trying to kick the ball up and out of the habittrail, whereas the coil in the 6 ball assembly just stops trying until the "auto find ball" mode.

I already played with Adjustment 36 and set it to "hard" on coil pulse level. It had no effect.

My guess is something is keeping those coils from energizing strongly enough. Anyone got any ideas?

I have never disassembled a VUK/Super VUK/coil mechanism before. This is new to me, and I'm going on strictly my observations. I have never, ever, ever seen the 6-switch ball mechanism coil struggle with launching a ball into the shooter lane at startup - never - not one single time. That lead me to believe that when multiball is happening and the game is acting like hell is breaking loose that there must not be enough current getting to the coil to energize it.

Are there any kinds of "how to"'s for disassembling a coil mechanism/VUK/Super VUK ? I'm not scared to try it; I'd just like some "veteran" advice or cautionary tales of anything I should be aware of before jumping into this.

Thanks!

Interesting - I definitely appreciate such suggestions! For the ball trough, I took off the apron and played the game while it was going into multiball mode and watched the coil that pops the ball into the shooter lane, and I saw it launch some balls but just not strongly enough to get the ball into the shooter lane.. HOWEVER, I have also taken note that both the Super VUK and the 6 ball trough shootering assembly have solid metal troughs that the balls roll in and out of - SO....

What did you use to file down your ball trough? I would assume sandpaper, and if so, what grit did you use? I will definitely give sanding my ball troughs down a try. Thanks!

Gotcha - yeah I had the apron off while I was playing and it definitely was settling into the VUK, then it went to fire it, and the ball didn't make it all the way so it'd fall back into the VUK and just settle there.

I'm working on trying to determine what size coil sleeve goes in the 6-ball trough lane coil. Anyone happen to know right offhand, or is this something I can judge by looking?

For the super VUK, I could disassemble it and use this kit: http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/565-0029-01

I cross-referenced all the parts in the kit to the Super VUK, and even though the kit is for VUKs, all the part numbers line up. Using this kit to rebuild the Super VUK would probably solve my problem.

Whatcha think?

Ok so here is where I'm at now,

I disassembled the 6 ball trough coil. I swapped coil sleeves, and everything else on that coil assembly was flawless. Coil looks to be the factory original: 090-5001 was what it said on the label. I re-soldered the joints just to ensure there was no cold solder joints. So the coil assembly is solid and the problem still is occurring. BUT....

Here is what I observed. If you let the machine just keep firing balls during electric chair multiball, 2 balls sneak past the lock ball assembly coil. So there's something not quite right with the lock ball assembly coil. My understanding is when the coil is activated, the lock bar is moved, allowing a ball to roll to the 6 ball trough coil ready to be shot into the shooter lane. So, if I'm thinking this through correctly, the ball lock coil has too much play in it - either because of a loose/worn out spring or a worn out coil sleeve. OR....

Maybe the Lock ball cam assembly is needing a thorough cleansing and is not functioning right... Thing that really gets me is with 6 balls in the trough at the start of any ball, the machine works fine - it is ONLY during multiballs does this happen... hmmm

What does everyone think? Anyone think I'm on the right track? Man, the things I do with pinball at 4:30 in the morning D: ...

FINALLY.... I fixed it!

Ok, so I did some internet scouring to find the fix to this problem - took me quite a while - this was probably easily the problem that has taken me the longest to diagnose and fix.

I wanted to give credit to the website that finally helped me get my gears going, but unfortunately I can't find it anymore. If I find it, I'll post it in hopes it'll help others down the road.

My problem was exactly what PostMaster had with his old TFTC in this previous thread:

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/tftc-cant-count-loses-count-of-balls-during-multi-ball

So, what was my problem? My ball launching switch was bad/old. Just to clarify, that switch is 90 degrees from the launch solenoid (this solenoid shoots the ball INTO the shooter lane, I am NOT referring to the door handle shooter solenoid). In the TFTC manual, it is on page 50 - item # 22 part # 180-5119-00. That switch was just old and beat to heck. What was happening was the coil that has the bracket bar that allows balls to move through the trough during multiball was too fast for the launch switch, so everytime multiball occurred, one extra ball basically got through the bracket bar, and the switch in essence, couldn't keep up. At least that's my understanding so far.

So, if you put that part number in any pinball website search engine, you're going to get the ball trough roller switch - which not only has the incorrect arm extension (the wrong switch has a roller ball on the end and not the triangle shaped arm you need), but it also has the incorrect mounting holes so you couldn't even install the cross-referenced switch if you wanted to.

So, what do you do ? You install this switch: http://bayareaamusements.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=SW-180-5034-00

It will read as a "Data East ramp switch" - now I don't know exactly what "ramp switch" is to suggest, as I didn't see it ANYWHERE in TFTC's manual, but trust me - it works just like the previous switch - triggered the switch is closed - untriggered the switch is open, and it does the job it is supposed to do.

Now, if you install that switch, you'll have to make one small modification. Take some wire cutters and clip the very very end of the arm right after the triangular bend. If you don't, that part of the arm will catch on the ball trough, and the switch will not function correctly. Just clip the end of the arm so the full triangular bend is the VERY end of the switch arm, and you'll be good to go.

Install the switch, putting the wires exactly in the same locations that they were on the previous switch. All the male spades are in the exact same places, so it should be a plug and play job - take pictures if you don't think you'll remember which wires go where; I know I took pictures.

The balls launch SO much faster with this switch. It was like - not a whole new machine - but it was like if you took your stock engine and installed a turbo on it - just a great feel and a wonderful improvement.

Anyhoo, hope someone somewhere down the road benefits from this post. Life is Good

Hey Crash. I just saw this thread getting attention again - so I'm sorry it took me a while to get back to you.

My thought after looking at the door switch assembly: maybe your switch isn't being properly tripped just due to old age/being used.

I think the switch is on page 53, bottom left-hand corner, part # 180-5073-00. Marco has a substitute for it: http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/180-5129-00

Thing I noticed in the picture is there is no diode on this switch, whereas in the manual there is one installed. No worries, it is a 1N4001 Diode, very standard in the electronics world:

http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/1N4001

So you could order the switch, solder the diode on the correct prongs AND in the right orientation, and then swap out your old switch with a new switch.

Picture of the TFTC door switch here for comparison purchases (out of stock ):

http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/515-5936-00

That is assuming that the switch is just old/needs replacing.

The other thing I think may be giving you trouble is the switch that the ball rolls over once it has left the ball trough and is rolling backwards into the shooter lane RIGHT before it is fired out of the shooter lane. It is on page 49 of the TFTC manual - part # 180-5057-00 - and available at Marco: http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/180-5057-00

Once again, the diode would need to be soldered. Here at Marco: http://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/1N4004 (same one as mentioned earlier).

To me, THAT switch I would check first before going through the risky trouble of disassembling the door handle switch. Easiest way to find out, when the ball sits in the shooter lane and doesn't fire like it should, open your coin door and use something like an insulated wire to grab the tip of the switch's trip blade. If you pull it down and the ball fires, you know it either needs to be adjusted or replaced.

Just wanted to send a quick "thank you" to everyone for the kind words. I am really glad this thread ended up helping some people. I remember a year ago saying "Hopefully, someday, this will help others...." - that's great that it is!

At one point I had JP and TFTC side by side. Unfortunately, I don't recall any black wires. I am looking at my TFTC now. The solenoid that pops the ball from the trough into the shooter lane has two wires: a thick brown wire and a thin purple wire.

But what I can do is provide pictures of the various switches around the area of the ball trough and shooter lane:

So below is the switch that trips the solenoid to fire the ball out of the trough and into the the shooter lane, where it waits for a different switch to fire the ball into the playfield (seen in next picture). Wire config from left to right: female plug with two wires (P/W and black), middle female plug is a green/red wire, top right is the other end of the black wire that originated at the 1st female plug - this wire will have a diode that in essence connects the 1st male spade to the 3rd male spade.

DSCF0208.jpg

Next, two switches in this picture. First one to the left is the switch reviewed in the previous picture. The other one here is the switch the trips the shooter lane to fire the ball out of the shooter lane and onto the playfield. Crash, I am thinking this may be the switch you want to replace first as it is easier to access than the door handle switch, and it would be more likely to be causing you trouble as I would think this one would see more wear/use in gameplay. Wire configuration: first male spade closest to the doorknob launch assembly has a purple/white wire attached as well as one end of a diode. Middle male spade has a green/red wire. Last spade is the other end of the diode from the first male spade. The silver stripe on the diode is CLOSER to this last male spade.

DSCF0207.jpg

Next, here we have two solenoids. To the left is the right flipper solenoid. To the right is the ball trough solenoid; we went over this one in the very first picture - just a different angle.

DSCF0210.jpg

Next, shooter lane to playfield launching switch. Crash, this is once again the switch that I think is giving you trouble.

DSCF0209.jpg

Finally, here are up-close and personal shots of the switch I installed to make all of my problems go away. Please note, it does look like my triangular arm is indeed a thin wire and not a solid and flat metal arm. Both switches that everyone has brought up in this thread should - in theory - work. I know mine works - just experiment at your own risk.

DSCF0212.jpg

Great stuff, Blackjacker! I'm glad anything I did in the past is helping people now!

That's what the hobby should be about - not investment hoarding or treating this community like a stock market trading floor -____-...

Awesome !!! I'm glad this thread just keeps helping more and more people!