"STERN!!!! Where's the friggin Code!"

It's down there somewhere, let me take another look.

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Here's a stupid question...with all the units Stern has pumping out the door now....do they not have the extra scratch to hire 1 or 2 more people to help finish code on games? They are falling further behind, while still making more titles.

That is a stupid question. That would eat into their profits. They cost cut the quality of their machines down to Made in Taiwan levels with pixelated, photoshop hack job art, paper thin plastics and whatnot, you expect finished programming code? Lol

Cranky Anti-Stern guy alert.... Derp!

Actually the have added a software guy this year and have reduced their game output to 2 in 2013 (Met and ST), where most years they put out 3.

http://www.pinballnews.com/news/tanio.html

IMO

They should take a break from new titles and remake some pins like tspp potc Tron AcDc etc.. While they work on finishing old games.

Until they finish old games *cough* XM LE I won't buy another new Stern game.

Believe they still need another given the current status of incomplete code

"We have someone requesting code captain!"

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Maybe it is not a matter of needing more programmers but rather motivating the ones they already have (not including Lyman obviously).

Do you realize a new programmer started at Stern on Monday? Maybe they aim to rectify the code complaints....

Let's hope the current guys aren't slacking.....We KNOW Lyman isn't. Thank goodness he is so dedicated..... at least.

I vehemently disagree. At the point where Stern stops making new games in favor of re-running old ones, we will know the pinball industry is in a state of collapse.

The new guys are probably the ramp up they need to work on a new OS. I can't see Stern continuing SAM games with JJP ramping up production. Competition is good.

Pat.

Alright, I know nothing about actual pin software code, but I spent five years doing hardcore coding. You can code many different ways to accomplish the same thing. There is good code, mediocre code and bad code.

Just adding a body to the programmer pool doesn't mean the problem is solved. My guess is there is some pretty crappy back end coding practices that hinder this whole process.

Now that Stern has some formidable competition, one would think they would step up their efforts in software completion and not just focus on selling boxes like they have been.

Does Stern owe Lyman money?

Someone needs to do a Downfall clip for unfinished code.

http://downfall.jfedor.org/

Dont forget to spam Sterns Facebook posts with this image and "any day now" Good luck to all of us getting some updates.

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So true, programming isn't a problem that just throwing bodies at fixes. Here's hoping it helps though!

Maybe start a petition on pin side and send it Stern's way.

To some extent Lyman, Borg, SR, etc are brand names in themselves. When they have their names attached to subpar pins it ends up diminishing their brands. Maybe they recognize this and initiate changes from within.

I would but I'm already blocked. I posted it on Borg's page in hopes he talks to management about Xmen code updates

I would be all over this. But am not sure about how to correctly word or go about such things. That's why I made my current thread, as an informal petition to illustrate the current code issues

My favorite quote is 9 women can't have a baby in a month. No truer words have ever been spoken when it comes to app dev. Adding bodies isn't going to help if they aren't A) the right bodies B) get in mid way or on the tail end of a development cycle / project.

Also even with talented individuals there is usually significant ramp up time when coding for a platform you are unfamiliar with. I can take 5 top tier developers who know C backwards and forwards, give them a task to build something on an unfamiliar platform and maybe 1 will succeed their first attempt?

This is fine but maybe put the new guy with Waison on Xmen to let them learn. This way you do not mess up or slow down current coding for ST and MET while making several people happy. I'd love it if Stern let Lyman polish off X-men, but it will not happen

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Playing devils advocate here, but...why does Lyman get a pass? We are still waiting for MET code.

And doesn't it seem like Lonnie actually does a better job than the others in terms of getting code "finished" sooner?

Cuz Lyman's games are always tits.

Exactly!

It's just a matter of time though. And that's the frustrating part.

My point was that from several people that have talked about Lyman in the pinball community, he has been stretched too thin and has even had to work on games at home in his personal time. It seems that Lonnie's games are fairly complete but lack the refinement which really makes games extra special. Lonnie seems to do just enough for the game to be acceptable. Lyman obviously has often been successful in doing the little things to get to that extra special level.

It would be nice to get the new code, but it is still pretty difficult to get through the old code. So when it gits here it gits here.

I'm one of the consumers that’s fortunate to be able to afford another pin (have mm and th ordered)....I have been waiting for stle. With all the info that has recently come out, esp re the code for st...I am now on the sidelines waiting. I can’t bring myself to buy a pin that there is a 50/50 chance of the code being finished or polished. Sterns track record is simply not good enough for me to commit and order. This simply cant be good for their business going forward. The perceived opinion of home collectors regarding Sterns unfinished games is hurting their future business...if not for anyone else, it has for me.

RobT

The code movement needs you

Join the rebel alliance

At dawn we attack

I suppose it comes down to what we, as a community, are willing to accept. Would we wait the extra weeks/months/year for rock solid coding? Or do we want the machines in our living rooms as soon as is humanly possible? Regrettably, I fall in to the latter category. I think we are showing good faith in a company that most would agree we are grateful exists at all. Where would modern pinball be without Stern??!! I'm excited about JJ, though I'm uninterested in the WOZ license. I will certainly check out a Hobbit machine when more info is available. No company wants unhappy customers. I think we can assume that Stern is doing its best to balance demand, production, competition, etc... All the while trying to be competitive in an industry that was all but dead only a short time ago. I lobby for a little patience, and understanding. I for one, am just happy they seem to be putting the right guys in place, and giving us great themed machines. There will be bumps in the road, but I'm just happy to be driving on it!! I have paid my 8K for a STLE. I want the software to be amazing, and I'm confident that it will be... Eventually! They've sort of got us over a barrel though, don't they!!???

Uh no, you didn't have to buy the game.

Am I the only one who thinks that Stern will change anytime soon when it comes to code releases has about the same odds as the Detroit Lions winning the Superbowl?

Like I mentionned in the other thread...just write to their twitter account @sternpinballinc and use hash tag #fixyourcode , #wheresthecode, #finishyourcode that way they can't pretend you don't exist.

Haha. I realize I don't HAVE to buy the game. My point was, I WANT the game. I'm willing to suffer the bugs as I have more confidence in Stern than the Lions!

Stern's response will be to dumb down the games like the late 2000's. "Nobody complaining about buck hunter or TRS so let's stick to that model!"

someone needs to photo shop Garys' face on this pic

Yeah, a distinct possibility that I've considered. But it will still eventually hit them in the pocket book. They weren't selling that many pins in the late 2,000s either.

Relevant

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Yes.

Because whatever he's being paid, it's not enough. I know there's no way in hell that I'm pre-ordering any new Stern which isn't programmed by Lyman. It's not even an option. I'm sure there are dozens of potential NIB Stern buyers who feel the same way.

Lonnie is hit or miss, mostly miss, but he has begun to take some of the aspects of rules designed by Keith and Lyman and add them to his machines now. Even so, Lonnie's best stuff still seems like a rehash/follow-the-leader ruleset. Waison I wouldn't trust to code my sprinkler system for the lawn. Jury's out on the new guy, although I heard he's a pinball enthusiast.

Basically, until such time as I see a new masterpiece rule design, coded by someone other than Lyman or Keith, I'm sitting out new machines coded by anyone else.

At least Stern is updating codes faster than most people are getting their WOZ's shipped.

This statement should sucessfully derail this thread

done

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Not necessarily. I think people are finally getting to the point where they don't care about the JJP vs Stern crap anymore. Plus, WOZs are finally making their way into the owners homes in more significant numbers (still a ton of people that don't have theirs yet, but definite progress is being made now).

Now the new thing to derail a thread is to bring up MMr or PPS remakes in general.

Kind of odd that you want to reward someone for not finishing their work in a timely fashion (update should have been out by now). Never worked that way at the tech companies I've worked for!

Also sad that 2 guys (Lyman/Keith) are carrying the weight of the entire pinball industry...