You need to tell us what the company is. We need to be warned. Plus thats why you give great service. Good experience gets more business bad experience loses business.

Did you sign a contract at any point before they started? Did that contract change as the estimate changed?

Yes, please do tell. We need to avoid this business at all cost.

This sucks.
If you did not have a signed contract, small claims would be tough, as you likely would have difficulty proving your story.
However, this business should be avoided.
You could still consider a credit card charge back.
Anyway, on the bright side............sounds like you did end up with a great machine.

WHo was the Company??

File with your CC company.....you have nothing to lose.
I doubt they gave any warranty you would feel comfortable bringing it back in.
Your CC should be able to negotiate a settlement that will help reduce the "extra" costs.

I try to play fair in life. What comes around goes around and all that. But when people play dirty you must play dirty as well.

You should check if they are a member of the Better Business Bureau. Also you should continue what you are doing and get their name out there as doing shady business. In this day and ago companies need to know that their customer service must be at least adequate otherwise people will use the internet and word of mouth to get the word out.

You should name the company and let's see what the responses from others here are about this company. I wouldn't care about what the Company and it's Owner thinks. What happened to you is unfair and poor business practices. The Owner and Techs kept stringing you along knowing they had you by the balls. Still I hope you have learned a valuable lesson about getting estimates and how sleazy a business can be. I would file a complaint with the BBB, for what it's worth and also with your State's consumer protection department, usually part of an Attorney General's office.

PM me the name of the company and I will do the reveal thereby relieving you of all liablity. DISPUTE THOSE CHARGES!!! Do not roll over like a baby seal waiting to get clubbed! I feel sorry for you and MAD at the same time. There are so many nice people in this hobby, and you had to run into the Chumley of pinball. so sorry for you

You already know what is going to happen if you ask them for money back... They are gonna tell you to !#@$ off.

Just file the claim with your CC (that is why you use a CC) and tell us the name of the company!!!! You have said/written nothing that would be considered slander or liable. You have provided the facts as you see them. Based on your story they are obviously unethical and that is not how you should do business in this small world.

Sorry for the pain and hardship, but glad you got a niz TZ to play now. Next step it to learn how to do some work for yourself >> part of the fun

I would try and dispute ALL the charges, not just the $800 and then let the business prove the work that they did.

I am sure you can find a different pin repair place that can give you a price that would be much much lower than this place charged you.

There are ways around this my friend, dont let this shitty business get away with it.

If you have a written estimate, you are good to protest the charges with the CC company. When it comes to estimates, they can only exceed the estimate by 10% without having you sign and agree to another written estimate. So , if I read your post correctly, the estimate you signed was for $1500. They can only legally charge you up to $1650 without your legal written consent.

Tell the credit card company that they padded the labor charges, could not provide any invoice(s) with itemized labor hours, and that you are NOT satisfied with the labor work. Furthermore , tell them they were holding your merchandise hostage and threatened to sell your merchandise if you did not pay the outrageous bill.

Screw them, just like they screwed you.

Your only real recourse is to take them to small claims court. It'll be hard to win a credit card dispute because it's not fraud.

You have no liability in disclosing who it was that screwed you over.....maybe you can help somebody else avoid these pr*cks down the road.....if he is any kind of businessman he would make it right and avoid the court of public opinion.....

The problem you have in court or with the credit card company is that you paid it along the way without drawing the line at the repair stage.......you were in a tough spot and sometimes in life you just get stuck with what I call the "dummy tax"....I've been hit with it many times before myself! I try to live and learn but I would make that guy pay by exposing his businesses practices...

I'm telling you as a lawyer if you are telling the truth and stating the facts you won't have any problems.....I wish I was there in Iowa, I'd love to file suit for you, pro bono, just to stick it up his a**

I think everyone missed the important part of that story... YOU PAID SOMEONE almost $3K to do a shop job and a couple mods???

Congrats to the company for seeing a sucker! Note: I don't condone ripping anyone off, but you should have done the research to see what the parts would have cost and then did a little research to see if you could have found someone cheaper or figured out how to take some screws/nuts loose yourself.

I would have paid with a check and stoped payment on it. Then sent a check for what you agreed upon plus whatever you feel you owed them above that. Probably not the legal way to handle the situation but at least then they have to fight you, not you fight them. Did you pay with a check? If not then dispute you cc transaction, for the sake of all other pinheads you must fight for all our rights. You are fighting for the people now. You can make a difference in this world. Were counting on you to teach these guys pinheads are not to be messed with. We have the right to honest service! Ok, maybe that's a little much but you get the point. As far as putting there name out there, I don't see how you could not. I felt your pain but I don't want to go through that. We need to know. Tell someone else and let them post it. Hell tell me and ill post it in a different thread if that makes you feel better.

Hope this doesn't sound too offensive... but I think the moral of the story could be: Learn to DIY.

It doesn't sound like they did anything too difficult. But it sounds like you ran into someone dishonest who took advantage of your lack of knowledge or desire to learn.

If you don't DIY... just like car repairs... call and get a couple estimates from several places (you do that don't you?). Find someone you trust to work on your car if you're not a mechanic yourself. Run things by a friend or two who is knowledgable. Perhaps you should've posted on the pinside forums asking for an idea of what kind of work needs to be put in for the specific errors you knew about.

In the future... get estimates in writing. If they're increasing prices on you by hundreds at a time get that in writing as well.

Sounds to me like they thought you had deep pockets because you were able to buy TZ in the first place, they already knew you had $4,200 in it, and they also knew they could charge whatever they wanted because you weren't just gonna say screw it and let them keep the game. It's not like you had a $4,200 car that you'd already paid off years ago and needed $2,800 in repairs. Screw the car and get another one. You just got the game and hadn't even had it in your house yet... They held your game hostage and made you pay the ransom!

You need to grow a set of balls. This guy walked all over you, and you should NEVER let that happen - they prey on it. Stand your ground.

1. Agree to the work - outline everything that will be done in writing.
2. They come back to you with financial changes - remind them of the original intent.
3. They won't budge after you get extorted - you take it all back (PERSONALLY - dont let them handle your stuff any longer), there are tons of folks here willing to help you, even you could figure it out.
4. Go on a campaign to tell others about your experience.

Screw them. If that person was within 10 miles of me, i would shove the gumball machine up his ass.

I have torn down 5 TZs in my life. Its intimidating at first, but its not complicated and doesn't warrant that type of money. Sure unseen issues come up during the teardown, but with exception to serious acid, cabinet or playfield damage, everything else is easily solved, especially to a 'trained' tech. So i am saying its BS (BULLSHIT) for them to use the unforeseen issue approach on a solid base game.

Not only that but you had to pre-agreed price at the start. And the 3 percent to 5 percent CC fee? Eff them. Even 3 percent is over the 1.5 - 2.8 tied to the card, depending on what it is.

At this point, chalk it up to experience dont let anyone walk over you again. You sound like a nice, reasonable guy, and i am sorry this happened to you, but you really really need to learn from this and not let these clowns do this - to you or the next guy.

You can now tell others of your experience with them. Out who it is (i know who it is because i have seen them do this in the past to others).

DO NOT worry about retaliation. You are stating your experience - you have the upper hand (for once). You are doing nothing malicious.

I just dont want to see others affected like you have.

Unfortunate you ran into a very bad vendor. You really should make him known to the community.

You might mention to the CC company the fact that he assessed a surcharge in order for you to use your card. That would be against the merchant agreement and could cause him some problems. Merchants may offer cash discounts - but they can't assess fees for using your CC.

Unfortunately you got screwed. May as well dispute the entire transaction and at least see if the bozo is willing to reach a reasonable settlement with you. Push a little pain back onto him.

by the way - congrats on the TZ. Please enjoy it despite the drama.

I second Iceman's opinion in full . . . you have zero liability. I'm laughing that he calls it the dummy tax, I call it the same . . . and yes, I've paid that tax many times myself. LOL.

The one saving grace is you paid by credit card, so what you do is charge back the total amount. Then tell the owner you're only going to pay what you actually agreed to pay, and if they don't like it they can take you to court.

Very unethical transactions and the company should be known to the pinside community, so we can avoid like the plague!

don't want to be rude or anything...

i understand that the people who fu*ked you up are bad!
but you also have to blame yourself, they keep charging and you keep saying yes... right there it should have ring a bell. they saw you couldn't handle a screw driver...

you paid way too much for something you can do yourself and in way less time, just by taking your time, pictures, infos, this forum and ask around... this is part of the hobby.

i really hope you do get some money back. this is a lesson learn.

$1,500 to add LEDs and a new set of legs is insane. That's the most expensive shop job I've ever heard of.

And did I read that right, you paid them cash? Now you can't cancel the check or dispute the charge, you have to sue them. I mean, even if I bought the entire story, why would you pay them cash?

You've only been here 3 days. I dunno, troll maybe?

Pinball is a luxury item. It's a "want", not a "need". So you had a bad experience, and lost some money. Oh well, life is full of bad experiences.

Working on your own games is a must. If you can't do that, you need to learn. Find a local tech that works for cheap, because you're always going to have repair issues. Maybe he can show you the ropes. Everyone needs to start somewhere.

But, with all due respect, it may be time to find another hobby. Sell and cash out. Do something that's fun and less stressful. Pinball isn't for everyone. It's expensive and requires heavy maintenance.

I wish my tz woulda been done in time to do our Totan for tz trade.

Your title says read this because it may help someone. Without naming the shop it helps no one. If everything posted here is true you are safe in naming the shop. If it isn't true, then certainly do not name them. And yes, if you have no interest in cleaning or doing minor repairs you really shouldn't own a 20 year old machine as complex as a pinball machine. It will cost you money and heartache along the way. I bet if you talked to 100 guys from this website 95 of them would tell you they enjoy tinkering with their machines almost as much as playing them if not more.

I would dispute those charges in a heartbeat. That shop is nothing but straight street scum if you ask me!

The shop is an operator and you know how operators can be! I will let MNpinballplayer throw the names out there if he wants but I know who he is talking about. Tried buying from them in the past but like most ops....they think they have gold and really have a routed machine that didn't get the proper attention while on route.

Pinballer22, it is good that you know but that does not help anyone else. Everyone here was ready to hang MAD Amusements in a few short minutes, these scumbags deserve no less. Share the name, spread the word!

He's MNPinballplayer... from Iowa? I don't get it? was IAPinballplayer taken?

Do share the name of this business.. Sucks that they shafted you, but do you want anyone else to go and be shafted as well?

Not to be a naysayer but I found all of that a little bothersome too.

Someone that knows, please tell us the city and state where this operator is located at minimum.

Without that, they could screw over someone else.

I met MNpinballplayer at Blainbrook a while back. Nice guy. He said he's been lurking here for a while. Glad to see you're posting, MNpinballplayer. Sorry to hear the bad news. Hopefully the pinsiders here will offer you some valuable advice.

I wish my tz woulda been done in time to do our Totan for tz trade.

i don't think you will be successful in a dispute. if they threatened to keep your machine, you call the cops. these guys are crooks. You really should learn to maintain these machines yourself. so you at least know when you're being ripped off. Sorry this happened. But i really think you're stuck

I've talked to him. I believe he moved from MN to IA.

I bet your TZ now has a bunch of hacked boards in it and cracked hidden plastics. If this is how it happened Those guys are ASSholes. They are the reason ops get bad raps! Pure dirt merchants!

Name and shame, sounds like a straight up scam to me. Chargebacks can be your friend.

As others have mentioned, I would dispute the charges. I would also note the additional charge for using a credit card as this is generally against terms (perhaps law). Its a bit of splitting hairs, but a merchant cannot charge extra for using a credit card - i.e., that cannot pass the credit processing fee to the customer. This is different than charging a lesser price for paying with cash. Certainly if there is a notation on a receipt for a 5% credit card fee, the cc company will want to know that as well.

There is no liability in either offering your experience with a company or expressing your (dis)satisfaction with the company. You can't tell untruths - but naming names of one you've had legitimate business dealings with is in no way liable or slander.

+1 There is know way you should be okay with this. Unless this was a high end restore (which clearly it wasn't) this is one of the biggest rippoffs I've heard in quite a while. BTW, you definitely should "out" these scam artists.

I'm done caring about this or even reading about this without a name. At this point its a pointless thread about a guy that got ripped off. Happens all the time. Useless info without a name so there can be a real.discussion. The question is a no brainer. If you got ripped off then dispute it. If you want.to talk about it give us the whole story(a name) so it can be discussed. Otherwise were talking about nothing.

May it have been http://www.kdamusement.com/ ??????

File a claim with the better business bureau, consumer protection agency and any other local, state or federal agency you can.

Dispute!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The Squeaky Wheel Gets the Grease

Sadly the better business burear and the consumer protection agencies really have no teeth . . . they usually are not the answer to any dispute (at least not in Louisiana or Texas, perhaps it is different where the OP lives).