true, true, true...........best pic i've seen in awhile......whew....
(Topic ID: 77267)
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The Hobbit
Jersey Jack, 2016-
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Jersey Jack, 2013
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Quoted from RobT:I think I just threw up in my mouth a little.
That's pretty extreme, isn't it?
Look, if certain people like Rob T, Teekee, Scooter, and others want to go through life thinking society is broken down by being winners and losers or "achievers" and "moochers" or whatever you want to call it, that's fine. If you want a total Lord of the Flies, dog eat dog, Laissez-faire society, be careful what you wish for. Because the "free market" for people who don't have anything is to come take what you've got. Take a look at South Africa and Mexico as examples of where these extreme disparities exist. That's where we are headed-- robberies, and kidnappings even in the wealthy areas, ESPECIALLY in the wealthy areas.
Anyway, this has all become what is not allowed here, which is politics. And I apologize for that. But the condescending eye rolls and "throwing up" in one's mouth just goes to show how out of touch some of you are. And even though you may think of yourself as a "winner" or "achiever", the tide can turn really fast and a little empathy goes a long way.
Go JJP. Just keep those greedy hands off of your product and desire to build a top notch game.
Quoted from usandthem:the tide can turn really fast and a little empathy goes a long way.
Empathy may go a long way, but my paycheck sure doesn't lately because I'm being made to pay for people who refuse to work and make this country a better place. And before you describe me as a fat cat, I'm actually a music teacher getting creamed by both parties right now, a republican governor and a democratic president. I work twelve hours a day, and that's before I begin doing rewrites on books or articles that I'm writing. Staying home doing nothing but playing pinball while I spend my life sucking at the government teat sure sounds like a nice life to me. But I've got too much pride to do that.
I hope Jack makes a pantload of cash in the pinball business, no matter how he gets there. And he'll deserve it because he had the balls and the drive to make it happen.
Quoted from PW79:spend fiat paper fueled in a petro electric lifestyle
Upvoted for this part alone.
Quoted from usandthem:But the condescending eye rolls and "throwing up" in one's mouth just goes to show how out of touch some of you are.
You realize you're on a forum where people buy $8,000 toys right?
Quoted from Rarehero:Not at all....I just don't think you really have any idea what you're taking about in regards to this situation.
Neither do I, for that matter - but lets look at some facts.
WOZ is way behind. It should have shipped a year or two ago...so - that's a year or two that Jack isn't selling tons of WOZ machines. Plenty of unforseen circumstances with parts, vendors, etc....every game built for a pre-order is not new money coming in for the company. Money is being spent but not made. It's not sustainable. JJP can be sustainable if they have multiple products on the line to sell (like Stern does).
OK, so those are the facts. I don't see greedy Wall Street vulture capitalists giving a shit about a pinball company. It's still a niche business. My guess, based on the facts at hand - JJP could use some financial help to get through the hump of WOZ's delay - some wealthy pinball enthusiasts came in to help...what they get out of it financially, we don't know...but it's none of our business. This allows JJP to pay employees,vendors, bills etc until Hobbit is complete - then they'll have 2 products to market and sell, business should pick up, everyone ends up happy.
Seems more reasonable than "selling their soul" and making this into an extreme scenario, eh?
You're making some good points, and I have a few to add.
It's reasonable to assume that the JDA people must've have looked at JJP's accounts receivables, especially with regard to what's due on the still undelivered preorders, before committing capital to the venture. All JJP preorders may not necessarily be all prepaid, and every cancellation and/or every lost sale/customer would trim down this (sizeable?) sum, along with the company's reputation which needs to be protected with a view towards JJP's long-term prospects.
I think JJP will now move forward without any other unnecessary complications which would certainly come about if JJP would opt towards short term easy "solutions". JJP's biggest strength/asset from the very beginning has been its "reputation marketing" (reputation management and brand marketing), and it would be sad to see this squandered. If this happened, everybody would lose, the hobby, the hobbyists, JJP, and JDA.
Then again, all we're doing here is just more mere speculation, isn't it?
Quoted from usandthem:Because the "free market" for people who don't have anything is to come take what you've got.
Well, that's the WORST argument against fee markets Ive ever heard.
And also one reason my OTHER hobby is protected by the 2nd Amendment...
Meanwhile, back on PINside....
You know nobody wins when we start talking about politics, when we descent into planet of the apes we'll talk about which ideology led us to it then...for now let's live in the matrix a bit longer.
Quoted from kvan99:You know nobody wins when we start talking about politics, when we descent into planet of the apes we'll talk about which ideology led us to it then...for now let's live in the matrix a bit longer.
Agreed, bring on the Hobbit!
Quit talking politics and political economic theory on a pinball forum. Talk about throwing up in my mouth.
Yup, consider this fair warning to all to stop it with the political and economic theories and rants. We actually got JerseyJack to come to a thread and talk, so let's at least keep this pinball related, play nice, and abide by the community rules.
Quoted from blondetall:Yup, consider this fair warning to all to stop it with the political and economic theories and rants. We actually got JerseyJack to come to a thread and talk, so let's at least keep this pinball related, play nice, and abide by the community rules.
How many times do Mods have to make this statement? If Robin would finally make me a mod we wouldn't worry about all this nonsense. I have the hatchet sharpened and ready…….
Quoted from TaylorVA:How many times do Mods have to make this statement? If Robin would finally make me a mod we wouldn't worry about all this nonsense. I have the hatchet sharpened and ready…….
Bring on the Taylor Chainsaw Massacre! 
Quoted from gambit3113:Quit talking politics and political economic theory on a pinball forum. Talk about throwing up in my mouth.
The last part of that is confusing. It should be construed as a rhetorical "Geesh! You want to talk about something that nauseates me and makes me throw up in my mouth? This political economic theory crap really does that job!"
But, if you took it in the way that I have to admit is open for interpretation, as "Hey, you guys! Instead of talking about this political economic theory stuff, you should instead be discussing vomiting into my open mouth" so be it. That makes you pretty weird, but if it cuts the "government teat" crap out of here, so be it.
Quoted from TaylorVA:How many times do Mods have to make this statement? If Robin would finally make me a mod we wouldn't worry about all this nonsense. I have the hatchet sharpened and ready…….
So are you going to start your own "TaylorVA for moderator" campaign like Gerry did?
Quoted from blondetall:So are you going to start your own "TaylorVA for moderator" campaign like Gerry did?
He's got the right avatar.....
Quoted from blondetall:So are you going to start your own "TaylorVA for moderator" campaign like Gerry did?
No, I assumed others would have done it by now and in all honesty I would have to decline because to be a mod you'd have to read all the all the people I have on ignore and I'm not sure that would be worth it.
Quoted from TaylorVA:No, I assumed others would have done it by now and in all honesty I would have to decline because to be a mod you'd have to read all the all the people I have on ignore and I'm not sure that would be worth it.
And I enjoy a good run on sentence and StevenP would get a ban vote for commenting on it.
This political/economic inequality talk blows. I remember when a guy created a fake account just so he could talk about that crap on the forum and stir things up. Wonder if he ever came back?
Quoted from TaylorVA:No, I assumed others would have done it by now and in all honesty I would have to decline because to be a mod you'd have to read all the all the people I have on ignore and I'm not sure that would be worth it.
I'm glad Taylor has me on ignore, because then I don't have to hear him rip me a new one for having a sense of humor he disagrees with. 
Yup, reading everything by everyone is time-consuming and most of the time boring. And of course there's no way we can keep track of everything when the entire front page refreshes in 3 hours now. When I joined June 2012, we were having a good day if the entire front page saw new posts within 24-48 hours, and there were even less topics shown per page then. You can always tell when something is going down when certain threads start blowing up the top 5 listings for the day. I'd have stopped the political talk earlier if I wasn't currently at work and in a 2 hour meeting where my boss would probably frown upon me pulling out my cell phone to check Pinside.
Quoted from TaylorVA:No, I assumed others would have done it by now and in all honesty I would have to decline because to be a mod you'd have to read all the all the people I have on ignore and I'm not sure that would be worth it.
Quoted from Pimp77:Let me know when any start up company builds a new game on a new platform in less than 3ish years...true it's 'behind' per Jack's salesman schedule, but did anyone REALLY think it would be complete in a year or even two? Maybe I'm the only one who thinks 3 years was a pretty decent timeline?
The problem with that is "reality". Business plans have budgets and timelines.
I understand loud and clear. There's a fine line between politics and economics sometimes. This is not my forum and I will definitely abide by the rules. I do believe that there is severe inconsistency in how the no politics/economics rule is enforced, however. Why is it that any mention of "free market" and "workers making $9.00/hr. should be happy with what they have" are seen as innocuous, apolitical statements? But any mention of push back against those ideas is seen as socialism worthy of one "throwing up in their mouths" and ban talk?
I thought that one of the goals of the hobby was to expand and not be so monolithic in who participates.
Quoted from usandthem:That's pretty extreme, isn't it?
Look, if certain people like Rob T, Teekee, Scooter, and others want to go through life thinking society is broken down by being winners and losers or "achievers" and "moochers" or whatever you want to call it, that's fine. If you want a total Lord of the Flies, dog eat dog, Laissez-faire society, be careful what you wish for. Because the "free market" for people who don't have anything is to come take what you've got. Take a look at South Africa and Mexico as examples of where these extreme disparities exist. That's where we are headed-- robberies, and kidnappings even in the wealthy areas, ESPECIALLY in the wealthy areas.
Anyway, this has all become what is not allowed here, which is politics. And I apologize for that. But the condescending eye rolls and "throwing up" in one's mouth just goes to show how out of touch some of you are. And even though you may think of yourself as a "winner" or "achiever", the tide can turn really fast and a little empathy goes a long way.
Go JJP. Just keep those greedy hands off of your product and desire to build a top notch game.
Politics...
Quoted from pinstor12:Take a long vacation to a socialist county if you are not happy here. Life is short.
Politics...
Quoted from usandthem:I understand loud and clear. There's a fine line between politics and economics sometimes. This is not my forum and I will definitely abide by the rules. I do believe that there is severe inconsistency in how the no politics/economics rule is enforced, however. Why is it... I thought that one of the goals of the hobby was to expand and not be so monolithic in who participates.
Honestly, personally, I don't want to hear anything at all about politics period. I don't care what people believe, and everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but when there's a back-and-forth banter about it on a pinball website that specifically says "no politics" in the community rules, and I've said that I'll help uphold those rules, then I do a blanket "stop talking about politics" warning.
For the record, I also personally don't want to hear anything about religion, and ESPECIALLY don't want to hear anything insurance and how it relates to politics/economics right now. I work for an insurance company, and I hear it plenty enough at work, and don't need it all rehashed on the forum where I go to for fun and enjoyment. We've got enough wars here lately over which luxury item manufacturer is better than which luxury item manufacturer without throwing heated topics that actual wars are started over into the mix.
Posted straight from the community rules (click the link to see them all):
NO POLITICS, RELIGION etc...
Please avoid politics, religion and other stuff that is known to cause wars around the world. This is a pinball site!
Quoted from usandthem:I understand loud and clear. There's a fine line between politics and economics sometimes. This is not my forum and I will definitely abide by the rules. I do believe that there is severe inconsistency in how the no politics/economics rule is enforced, however. Why is it that any mention of "free market" and "workers making $9.00/hr. should be happy with what they have" are seen as innocuous, apolitical statements? But any mention of push back against those ideas is seen as socialism worthy of one "throwing up in their mouths" and ban talk?
I thought that one of the goals of the hobby was to expand and not be so monolithic in who participates.
You have a point, and I for one have no problem with healthy debate without name calling. Anyone suggesting that workers should be happy at $9 hr does not understand how the market works anyway. Their is an entry point into a job. When you get a job, the amount of skill or lack of dictates how much someone is willing to pay you. If you have no skills and someone with skills will work for the minimum wage, then the man without skills will not be hired. I started out making well under $9, learned skills. Now I own a home and a bunch of pins.
Economics
Quoted from blondetall:Honestly, personally, I don't want to hear anything at all about politics period. I don't care what people believe, and everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but when there's a back-and-forth banter about it on a pinball website that specifically says "no politics" in the community rules, and I've said that I'll help uphold those rules, then I do a blanket "stop talking about politics" warning.
For the record, I also personally don't want to hear anything about religion, and ESPECIALLY don't want to hear anything insurance and how it relates to politics/economics right now. I work for an insurance company, and I hear it plenty enough at work, and don't need it all rehashed on the forum where I go to for fun and enjoyment. We've got enough wars here lately over which luxury item manufacturer is better than which luxury item manufacturer without throwing heated topics that actual wars are started over into the mix.
Posted straight from the community rules (click the link to see them all):
NO POLITICS, RELIGION etc...
Please avoid politics, religion and other stuff that is known to cause wars around the world. This is a pinball site!
If you politic certain religions you can get great insurance prices!
Quoted from PEN:You have a point, and I for one have no problem with healthy debate without name calling. Anyone suggesting that workers should be happy at $9 hr does not understand how the market works anyway. Their is an entry point into a job. When you get a job, the amount of skill or lack of dictates how much someone is willing to pay you. If you have no skills and someone with skills will work for the minimum wage, then the man without skills will not be hired. I started out making well under $9, learned skills. Now I own a home and a bunch of pins.
Economics
She's gonna get you!
Sana'a
Quoted from surfsidedetail:The Ponzi scheme needed new money
Ponzi never delivered any product. Bad comparison. Also, I am not an investor, I am a customer.
Quoted from surfsidedetail:The Ponzi scheme needed new money
fonzi-scheme-demotivational-poster-.jpgQuoted from Rarehero:Of course you love hearing it - sounds exactly like your rants about PPS "taking money away from" Stern/JJP. Seems like you want them to "spread the wealth" for the common good. Hypocrisy, thy name is Teekee!
Wow.
Quoted from usandthem:That's pretty extreme, isn't it?
Look, if certain people like Rob T, Teekee, Scooter, and others want to go through life thinking society is broken down by being winners and losers or "achievers" and "moochers" or whatever you want to call it, that's fine. If you want a total Lord of the Flies, dog eat dog, Laissez-faire society, be careful what you wish for. Because the "free market" for people who don't have anything is to come take what you've got. Take a look at South Africa and Mexico as examples of where these extreme disparities exist. That's where we are headed-- robberies, and kidnappings even in the wealthy areas, ESPECIALLY in the wealthy areas.
Anyway, this has all become what is not allowed here, which is politics. And I apologize for that. But the condescending eye rolls and "throwing up" in one's mouth just goes to show how out of touch some of you are. And even though you may think of yourself as a "winner" or "achiever", the tide can turn really fast and a little empathy goes a long way.
Go JJP. Just keep those greedy hands off of your product and desire to build a top notch game.
I ain't sayin' shit. But I got yer back. 
Quoted from PEN:Ponzi never delivered any product. Bad comparison. Also, I am not an investor, I am a customer.
It is a bad comparison because a ponzi scheme pays returns or in this case builds machines for the original investors with the money from new investors.
We know not all original investors are enjoying their "returns"
Quoted from surfsidedetail:It is a bad comparison because a ponzi scheme pays returns or in this case builds machines for the original investors with the money from new investors.
We know not all original investors are enjoying their "returns"
If time goes by and someone is left without a machine or a return of their money, then you are right. Untill then, your a pot stirrer. What is your motivation?
Quoted from PEN:If time goes by and someone is left without a machine or a return of their money, then you are right. Untill then, your a pot stirrer. What is your motivation?
I don't get it either. Assuming we all have a love of pinball in general why hang out in the WOZ part of the forum if you hate it? Why not instead go to an AC/DC or somewhere you like? The only motivation I can see is you enjoy ticking people off like the green fly at a picnic.
JJP has delivered about 600 games pretty close to the innovation and higher quality envisioned. I don't like the wait but there's no indication Jack is about to cut and run with our money. It's unfair to his reputation to suggest otherwise.
Quoted from JoeJet:Just got this.
--------------------
This partnership will now enable Jersey Jack Pinball, Inc. to have the resources to fund multiple game platforms, expand into related technologies and markets, and to provide a catalyst for growth. It further provides Jersey Jack Pinball, Inc. with deeper management and financial resources.
The "multiple game platforms, expand into related technologies and markets" is what caught my eye. Hope it is not something like video slot machines. We all remember what happened at Williams. Just saying.
Also, does "deeper management" mean some loss of control in exchange for financial help?
Quoted from wtatumjr:but there's no indication Jack is about to cut and run with our money. It's unfair to his reputation to suggest otherwise.
People haven't been suggesting he'd "run off" with the money.
They've been suggesting he might "run out" of the money.
Meanwhile it appears after 3+ years only 600 games shipped, factory workers were laid off & then investor capital appeared.
We usually hear the word "troll" any time someone doesn't fabricate or agree with an elaborate rebuttal to benefit JJP. I do think that's all behind us now due to the cash injection however. This forum will probably be a much better place pretty soon. Workers & parts at JJP should start moving around which is really what a lot of the arguments have been about this whole time.
Quoted from PW79:Ever wonder why humans have been douchebags since the beginning of time?
Because we're all engineered to BE douchebags. It's our destiny.
Every timeframe, every culture, every geographical location, from the beginning of time until it ends. We are humans & history repeats itself because we have more ape in our DNA than the alien colonizers.
Read the bible if that's your thing, read today's paper, shit just read the Stanford Prison experiment & you will see there is no fixing anything. The reptile brain had its limits & we too have ours.
So keep complaining. Keep pointing the finger at people as you consume subsidized grains & selfishly spend fiat paper fueled in a petro electric lifestyle that comes at a huge human expense in places you & I never see.
Most intelligent post I have ever read on pinside...........We humans like to think we are more than what we are.
Quoted from HeyYouSir:The "multiple game platforms, expand into related technologies and markets" is what caught my eye. Hope it is not something like video slot machines.
Maybe it would be something like simultaneously creating a virtual & physical pin...so they could release it on The Pinball Arcade app as well. Extra income from download purchases & massive advertising for the real deal.
Quoted from surfsidedetail:The Ponzi scheme needed new money
Close -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_scheme
The tokens were all those T-Shirts ...
Quoted from PW79:People haven't been suggesting he'd "run off" with the money.
They've been suggesting he might "run out" of the money.
Meanwhile it appears after 3+ years only 600 games shipped, factory workers were laid off & then investor capital appeared.
If I were Jack, I'd deflect attention with some type of outlandish, "epic" announcement. Better yet, it would be an epic announcement of an upcoming epic announcement. No one can bullshit better.
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