(Topic ID: 8847)

Bally X's & O's 1984 "READY"! Picture blog. :D

By Angyalpor

12 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

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  • 100 posts
  • 11 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 10 years ago by Angyalpor
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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There are 100 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 2.
#51 12 years ago

My, I'm also will be more happy, if I can repair the original one... I go and try to trace it, I hope, it's a visible damage...

#52 12 years ago

Hm, funny.
I follow the cable from the A9 panel J2 17. That is grey one, with white stripes. Follow, follow, move it, check it, but nothing problem with it. But it did not goes to the lamp, it goes to the lamp matrix. I attach a picture, it's the 13th from the right side...
Now I follow from the lamp, that is grey with brown stripes on it...
I try to understand the schemetics, but that is chinese for me...

Oh, and there is (C) between that two cable...

#53 12 years ago

Hm, even more i cannot understand...

I follow the cable from the lamp (grey, with brown stripes), and it goes to the A9 J2 too.
You can see on my previous pictures, I put the jump wire on the bottom one, and this is the 4th from the bottom. There is (C) between the two end, so now i don't know, what to do. And all connectors, soldering looks original...

#54 12 years ago
Quoted from Angyalpor:

Hi!
I follow your instructions, and looks like the wire is broken. The soldering looks ok, I give ground to the connector, and nothing happens. then I try to put a direct cable from the A9J2-17 to the lamp, and then works, when it needs to ( I lengthen the cable, one half is red, the other is black, but that is one. ) .
So means, my cable was broken somewhere...
As I see, so difficult to install a cable, near factory-way. Any suggestion, how should I do it? Simple leave the wrong cable, and attach a new one to the band? And how can I open the connector...? Or leave the connector, cut the original, and lengthen it...?

Attachments lamp.jpg (116.8 KB, 0 downloads) 2 hours old a9.jpg (97 KB, 0 downloads) 2 hours old

I don't understand, gray with white stripe? When I look at your two pictures above, J2-17 is grey/brown on both ends?

#55 12 years ago

Both look Gray/Brown to me:

a9.jpga9.jpg lamp.jpglamp.jpg

#56 12 years ago

Yes, this is correct.

First, I try to follow the schematics, there shows the nr.17 to the bottom of the connector (what is originally the 20th...

Now this is different, I try to give ground for it...
Meanwhile i resoldered the lamp matrix's connector, it always has a contact problem...

#57 12 years ago

No, pin 17 is the one I have circled....See the little '20' on the board? That's pin 20...So you count back four pins.

#58 12 years ago

So, i give ground to the good 17th, and the lamp works.
Hm, follow your steps, what is scr, and where can i find it? And how can I test?

#59 12 years ago

Well, first thing, have you reflowed the solder on that header? Remove the board and reflow the pins, adding a little solder. Also, follow the traces on the back make sure you have continuity.

#60 12 years ago

The SCR in question is Q9....Should be marked on your board. And R17 is part of that too. Check R17 on ohms...should read the same as R16 and R15. Probably around 2Kohms.

#61 12 years ago

To test the SCR:

Put your meter on Diode test...

Take the black lead of the meter and put it on the outside leg marked C on the board. Looking at the board oriented upright, C is on the left I believe. Take the red lead of your meter and put it on the opposite outside leg...Should be marked G on the board. Your meter should read around .6V

Now, swap the leads....Meter should read around 1.5V.

EDIT:::: Do this with power off and J2 disconnected....That should be clear, but just to reiterate

1 week later
#62 12 years ago

Hi! I haven't time to repair until today, sometimes I need to work...
So, tomorrow will I continue. So, my dumb questions: what is SCR? Because I don't know, I have no idea what I should check...

And the other thing... My feature lamp has always contact problems, so I try to re-solder the pins, as you recommend. But, if I add solder, the old one drops it down. Looks like, they are incompatible, or something... I plan to de-solder all the pins, clean the board, and the hole on it, and re-solder the pins with my solder. Is it the good way to repair it?

solder.jpgsolder.jpg

#63 12 years ago

So, I investigate what is SCR, and I check all of them with DMM.
I've got funny results. Almost all gives value arond 0.725, but:
The Q9 does nothing
The Q6 gives 1.4,but just for a moment
And the Q3 gives 0.210 .

If I change polarity, then all of them shows value between 1.3-2.0, but just for one moment, then drops back to 1 (is I not touch nothing, my DMM also shows 1). Except the Q3, that gives 0.150 permanently.

scr.jpgscr.jpg

#64 12 years ago

Q9 is likely bad since it did nothing....replace it.

Yes removing the old solder and putting in new is an excellent repair.

#65 12 years ago

Wow, I looks like dumb, I wait your answer like Christmas.
Then, I order a new one, but the others? Are they ok?

Means, I need to change the Q9 only?

#66 12 years ago

Probably but scrs are cheap....buy a few extras

#67 12 years ago
Quoted from robertmee:

Probably but scrs are cheap....buy a few extras

And the others? What also no good? Should I change he others?

#68 12 years ago

No, the others are probably ok....In that the device associated with Q9 is not working, and the test of Q9 was way out of spec, I'm pretty confident that one is bad. The couple of others could be affected by other devices in circuit with the SCR. The only real foolproof method of testing is to desolder them from the board, but why go to that trouble? If the devices associated with those other SCRs are working, leave them alone. What isn't broke, don't fix....

#69 12 years ago

Hm, ok, then I will buy one, and replace it.
The schematics said, it should be bad?

#70 12 years ago

Yes, Q9 is the SCR for the lamp you say is not working

Again, I would buy at least three, just to have on hand if you plan on keeping this game around. Always keep a stockpile of commonly used components.

#71 12 years ago

Thanks a lot, now I order them, and replace this one.

On the schematics, where I should see it?

#72 12 years ago

Here

aux_lamp_board.jpgaux_lamp_board.jpg

#73 12 years ago

Wow, thanks! You are a treasure here.

I ask the part on the Hungarian forum, and they said me this:

4A 400V Igt: 0.2mA MCR106-6G (ONS) RoHS TO-225AA (TO-126) SENSITIVE

Is it will be good for me? (One piece is about 40c... )
And should I change the two other one (Q3,Q6), or leave them, if everything is working?

#74 12 years ago

Yes, the MCR106-6 can be used....It's just a higher voltage rating than the -1.

Leave them if the devices they control are working.

#75 12 years ago

Ok, Master

But please, tell me, how can I thank you this lot help... Seriously, you should open an on-line pinball repair service...

#76 12 years ago
Quoted from Angyalpor:

But, if I add solder, the old one drops it down. Looks like, they are incompatible, or something... I plan to de-solder all the pins, clean the board, and the hole on it, and re-solder the pins with my solder. Is it the good way to repair it?

Are you trying to use lead-free solder? Lead-free solder has a different melting temperature I believe. This older type of solder with which these boards were constructed with is supposed to be banned from sale in most European countries these days.

You'll need to get hold of some this older type electrical solder made from lead. Most of the older family run electrical/hardware shops will still have this type of solder in stock if you ask. You won't get it if you go to any of the modern electronics stores.

#77 12 years ago

Hm, good idea...
I will try to find an old-style solder, maybe it will better. ..

#78 12 years ago

I thing, I will go crazy.

Now I assemble the machine, and a few thing is not working on the feature board. The soldering is ok, everything looks good.
The O nr.3, and the O nr.8 is not working. As I see, these two lamps belong to my other two wrong thyristors. But last time they are ok. How can they broken down like this? So, I think, I need to change them, too...
And, the last problem (now. ), is the X nr.4. I attach a picture, it is so dim... At the lamp test it does nothing, but while I play, it can light, but roughly half brighter, then the others... What can be the problem there? dim.jpgdim.jpg

#79 12 years ago

Reseat your connectors

#80 12 years ago

Hm, and the other two "O" problem can be because the wrong SCRs?

#81 12 years ago

Anythings possible.....im travelling and have no access to schematics....

#82 12 years ago

If I read the schematics well, then those two belongs to these lamps... How can they broke down like this... :S Whatever, they not gives back good values, better to change.
And if this dimmed X means wrong connection somewhere... I try to follow it's way...

#83 12 years ago

So, at the weekend I cannot buy thyristor, so I clean the coin door, and the front legs.
I think, worth.

before.jpgbefore.jpg leg4.jpgleg4.jpg

#84 12 years ago

Anythings possible.....im travelling and have no access to schematics....

Wow, all my respect to You!
I change the thyristors, that shows wrong values, and all of the lamps comes to live. Now, only one X is not working on the feature board, but I follow your instructions, and found the last wrong thyristor, on the A5 board. Unfortunately, it's not the same type, then the last ones, so I need to buy this type too. SCR 2N5060, as I see, it's a common model.

Almost 100%.

1.jpg1.jpg 2.jpg2.jpg

#85 12 years ago

Do you mean the Q3 thyristor? If so it should be the same value as the others on the board. Someone may have changed it at some time and used a different one.

#86 12 years ago

No, no, I change 3one on the A9 board, that is on the photo. These ones are the same thyristors, type MCR106-3. I bought a few spare, but this one is on the A5, and type 2N5060.

#87 12 years ago

Ok sorry the picture confused me.

#88 12 years ago

No problem.
I will hunt this type here in Hungary, or some equivalent. Then I reach the 100% mechanical and electrical condition.

#89 12 years ago

Congrats!

#90 12 years ago

All glory is yours, thanks guys!
Monday i buy the thylistors, and fix it.
Can I buy the next one,to bring back to life... ?

#91 12 years ago

I've nothing to do today, so I continue the cleaning.
Transformer, and power board.
A few picture from before, and after. Looks like, it has got some beer, or Coke in the 90's.
I cannot remove it with cleaner, water with tootbrush... Now clean, but I only can scratch it down, so I let there, I don't want to harm the panel.
Important: clean, and not smells.

before1.jpgbefore1.jpg before2.jpgbefore2.jpg

#92 12 years ago

And after the cleaning:

after1.jpgafter1.jpg after2.jpgafter2.jpg

#93 12 years ago

I mounted back, but before I clean the whole cabinet. I clean the cables, and wash the wooden parts.
There is a few spot on it, but at least, clean, and smells like furniture, not stable...

cabinet.jpgcabinet.jpg

#94 12 years ago

Today I do the final step, clean and repair the backbox. The bottom is broken, and it was dirty... I check, what I need for repair, and clean it. Soon the pinball will be ready... One thirystor, the bottom of the box and the headglass, aaaaand over.

before1.jpgbefore1.jpg vandal.jpgvandal.jpg after1.jpgafter1.jpg

#95 12 years ago

I change the last two wrong thyristor, now my lamps are perfect.
The backbox is ready, too
I use metal corners, and wood glue, what will be transparent afrter drying.
Of course, from outside you cannot look nothing repair...

Now, only my backglass is needed, and the pinball is ready.

hold.jpghold.jpg glue1.jpgglue1.jpg glue2.jpgglue2.jpg

#96 12 years ago

So, I need to say: Ready.

Working, playable, sunshine happiness.
I'll get a playfield sticker, and then no need to touch, just for repair.

Thanks, Robertmee, Shock_me, and Pinsiders!

Bonus question: what do you think, what I use for cabinet black paint repair?
First picture, when half part repaired, the second when I'm ready...

top1.jpgtop1.jpg top2.jpgtop2.jpg

#97 12 years ago

Shoe polish?

#98 12 years ago

One point for you.

1 year later
#99 10 years ago

Hi!

Next step: Battery holder.

There is the "before" picture, with the parts (holder, old battery with the diode, and the rechargeable batteries),

first.jpgfirst.jpg

and the "after" picture, withe the soldered holder, and the spare diode, if I need it in the future...

sec.jpgsec.jpg

Have a nice day:

4 weeks later
#100 10 years ago

So, now looks like the pin is ready( of course, it never can be. ), so the older brothers arrived for repair.
I will post a lot question at the EM forum, as I see...

brothers.jpgbrothers.jpg
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