(Topic ID: 40304)

Anyone else having issues with Color DMD + STTNG?

By Stack15

11 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 20 posts
  • 10 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 10 years ago by Milano
  • Topic is favorited by 15 Pinsiders

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#1 11 years ago

Here is my other thread:

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/sttng-very-very-very-weak-flipper

What I thought was a flipper coil problem turns out to probably be related in some way to my new color DMD. Or I could just be crazy.

Here is the synopsis - last night I installed the color dmd. I watched a few animations and then went to bed. I had some friends over today and they all said the right flipper was weak. I thought it was just out of place because I rebuilt it last month. So I went to play it after they left and the right flipper is not only weak... it is EXTREMELY weak -- can't even hit the ball past mid field weak.

I asked for some help... checked out the connections, reflowed the joints... still weak. I unplugged the color DMD and the flipper works great!

Has anyone else had this issue? The color DMD plugs into slot J116 which I thought was just coin door power. It has a three prong connector to take what was in J116 and piggy back it onto the plug for the color DMD. I tried to take the old J116 connector and plug it into the AUX on the back of the color DMD but the cord isn't long enough.

So what do I do? Obviously I want to use my $400 color display. But if the game doesn't work with it installed... then what??

#2 11 years ago

Now that you know where the issue is, contact ColorDMD. Having spent years in Mfg/Service companies I can tell you that the mfg would prefer you contact them and let them fix the situation. They know more about their product than anyone here does.

#3 11 years ago

I just sent them an email. I found a few threads on here where people are having issues. Apparently the popular idea is to connect the color DMD to its own power supply. I don't know how to do that.

I hope they make a fix, but I'm going to have to put the old DMD back in so I can play the game.

#4 11 years ago

According to posts here on Pinside - YES.

LTG : )

#5 11 years ago

Hi guy's, new member here.
I usually hang out over at KOLV so I hope you don't hold that against me.
I just installed the color dmd kit in my STTNG and I love it and wile it works, my game has a couple problems which seems worse sense the dmd install. My problems seem to come and go but appear to be related to the 12 volt unregulated power. My upper flipper was weak and would not return sometimes when released. The bushing was gummed up so I rebuilt all 3 flippers which seemed to fix the problem. The game would sometimes lose a ball so I found a diverter bushing was gummed up and stuck from old grease so I fixed it. Sometimes the cannons slow down and some times they run fast even with the laser canon mod. Now that I have the color dmd installed sometimes it works fine but when the cannons slow down the flippers get weak, mostly the upper right flipper which can hardly bat a ball and the game will loose track of a ball. It leads me to believe the problem is in the 12 power as it supplies the opto's and cannon motors and the color dmd puts even more strain on the power. The power driver board is all original so I suspect it could use new bridge rectifiers and filter caps which I have on order. I'll be interested to find out what your problem turns out to be. If it needs a aux power supply then I'll have no problem with that, the color dmd is a keeper as well as the laser cannon mod.
Here's my color dmd install video

#6 11 years ago
Quoted from SaminVA:

Hi guy's, new member here.
I usually hang out over at KOLV so I hope you don't hold that against me.
I just installed the color dmd kit in my STTNG and I love it and wile it works, my game has a couple problems which seems worse sense the dmd install. My problems seem to come and go but appear to be related to the 12 volt unregulated power. My upper flipper was weak and would not return sometimes when released. The bushing was gummed up so I rebuilt all 3 flippers which seemed to fix the problem. The game would sometimes lose a ball so I found a diverter bushing was gummed up and stuck from old grease so I fixed it. Sometimes the cannons slow down and some times they run fast even with the laser canon mod. Now that I have the color dmd installed sometimes it works fine but when the cannons slow down the flippers get weak, mostly the upper right flipper which can hardly bat a ball and the game will loose track of a ball. It leads me to believe the problem is in the 12 power as it supplies the opto's and cannon motors and the color dmd puts even more strain on the power. The power driver board is all original so I suspect it could use new bridge rectifiers and filter caps which I have on order. I'll be interested to find out what your problem turns out to be. If it needs a aux power supply then I'll have no problem with that, the color dmd is a keeper as well as the laser cannon mod.
Here's my color dmd install video

The color DMD is the problem, needs a separate power source.

LTG : )

#7 11 years ago

I've played mine a fair amount since installing the color DMD......haven't really noticed anything different.

In fact I got my highest score yet right after installing it.

My machine does have the higher power flipper coils installed.

Plus mine was a re-import......could that have anything at all to do with it?

#8 11 years ago

Mine is working great without a separate power source. Are you guys that are having problems running toppers as well? I actually out my toppers and other lighting on its own power supply.

#10 11 years ago

This is what color DMD says to do. I think this stuff is on the power driver board.

Sorry you're having trouble. A few customers have reported an issue after installing the ColorDMD in STTNG.

So far it seems like the issues are related to a weak 12V power supply, or overtaxing the 12V supply by running too many mods. In some cases customers had issues prior to installing the ColorDMD that were worsened after the display was installed.

If your game falls into one of these categories, you may want to try replacing the 12V bridge and capacitor or at least reflowing the solder joints to see if there's an improvement. I would also advise you try cleaning the flipper button opto sensors to see if there's a combination of reduced current and dirty opto that are causing the specific issue with your right flipper.

Hope this helps.

#11 11 years ago

My game has zero mods other than the color display. The cannons work fine. The only problem I notice is the right lower flipper doesn't have enough strength to move a ball. Honestly, I don't know what a bridge and capacitor are but I can clean the flipper optos.

#12 11 years ago

The cannons still work when the shafts are gummed up, they just cause the motors to strain and pull more current. I would clean the optos on the flipper boards and if it's only the one weak flipper try moving the board from the right side to the left and if the lower left flipper is now weak I would replace that opto.

#13 11 years ago
Quoted from Stack15:

Honestly, I don't know what a bridge and capacitor are

If the other flippers are fine, the bridge and capacitor aren't your problem.

LTG : )

#14 11 years ago

I just did some testing on my game and based on what I found I think my 12 unregulated power supply is the problem. As I said before I was having issues with slow cannon motors and opto problems before I installed the color dmd so in my case I don't believe the problem is because of the color dmd but because it uses power from the 12 unregulated power supply it makes my original problem worse. Ok here's what I did.
I first checked my AC power at the plug with my Kilowatt power strip and I had 117 VAC even with the game powered up.
I then put the game in test switch mode and tested my flipper opto's. The lower right switch was fine but the upper right switch was cycling on and off which would give me the weak flipper. I cant swap my flipper opto boards as I know the left upper flipper opto is bad. So next I checked the voltage on test point 1 which is the 12 unregulated power supply and I was getting a whopping 10.5 volts DC. Well maybe the opto is weak and going bad but it might be starving for power. Next I unplugged the color dmd and tested at test point 1 and I was now getting 12.05 volts DC, which still seems a little low to me.
So the next step is to replace the bridge rectifiers and filter caps. I have the parts on order so I hope this will fix my problem.
As for the flipper opto's I know the left upper is bad and maybe the upper right is weak so I might as well repair these but I don't know if I should repair my flipper boards or just replace them with new boards and repair and keep the old for backup. Which is the best flipper boards on the market, opto or the ones with magnets? My old boards have the 4 pin opto's
Now it's the parts waiting game.

#15 11 years ago

just replace the 4 pin optos. Mouser carries them for $1 a piece. The magnetic ones seem to just take a single object (a switch) and makes it overly complicated. You can even replace the opto boards with a pair of low voltage leaf switches and not have to worry about using 12V to power the flipper switches.

#16 11 years ago

Just a quick note, my STTNG with the new Color DMD is now working 100%. Turns out my 12 volt unregulated power supply in the game was going bad. It was only putting out 10.5 volts. I installed a new BR-5 bridge rectifier and C-30 filter cap and it now out puts 12.8 volts and all my problems disappeared and the game is working 100% again. The new BR-5 bridge rectifier still gets hot but is much cooler than before and seems to be normal.

3 months later
#17 10 years ago

Sam, your video was very helpful. Thank you for posting it. I am a beginner and have done some board repair. Your video clarified a few steps that I understand much better now.

#18 10 years ago

STTNG uses a ton of optos. Optos run off that 12v circuit that you're adding the ColorDMD to. Low power to the optos makes everything involved feel "weak".

I ran into the same exact thing when I installed one on our STTNG. Just beef up the 12v circuit (usually a new BR) or put in an external 12v supply for the ColorDMD.

3 weeks later
#19 10 years ago

Thanks for this and the previous thread, fairly new to pinside community and to modding/restoration of my machines - Just traded for a STTNG machine and added the colorDMD.

So far no power issues BUT my backbox illumination seems dead. Backbox flashers still work during gameplay, but the (sorry I don't know the term - marquee decorative bulbs?) are out.

I'm wondering if the backbox illumination was what originally went into J116? I had to remove that cable (a 4 pin I believe) and replace it with the one that came with the board, which had a little male-to-male adapter for me to (is slave the right term? or piggyback?) the original cable onto.

I recently found on the thread that I can play the game without the dmd installed (probably shoulda presumed that) so I'll try unplugging it - hoping this is just a connection that needs to be reseated or a bad cable that ColorDMD should have to replace.

Anyone else having this issue? Been following the power issues. I must say my flippers did feel a bit weaker (will see if that rectifies too) than before but not so as to affect gameplay at all. Machine seems to play quite fine in all respects.

If people are choosing to run colorDMD off an external power source, are there any threads on the subject for a noob like myself?

I'm still just getting a grip on LED conversions and basic modding. Got a Williams Indy that needs bridge rectifier replacement and I'm terrified - got a kids' soldering kit to practice even touching a board.

#20 10 years ago

Fixed this issue; DMD not the culprit - retracted

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